Main Page | Report this Page
 
   
Science Forum Index  »  Optics Forum  »  Designing mirrors for image projection
Page 1 of 1    
Author Message
Bruno Barberi Gnecco
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:02 pm
Guest
I need to design an optical setup to project images coming from a
multimedia projector to certain surfaces, for instance a cylindrical
screen. I've been thinking about using mirrors for that instead of lenses,
since they seem to be cheaper and easier to work with (I can use polished
metal sheets, for instance).

I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

Thanks a lot for any help.
Guest
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:02 pm
Quote:
        I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

        Thanks a lot for any help.

Check out Andy Hicks freeform optics design work at:
http://www.math.drexel.edu/~ahicks/
http://www.math.drexel.edu/~ahicks/design/

Michael
http://www.oscintl.com/Consulting/custom_fisheyes.htm
Helmut Wabnig
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:33 pm
Guest
On Tue, 12 Feb 2008 17:02:46 -0200, Bruno Barberi Gnecco
<brunobgDELETETHIS@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:

Quote:
I need to design an optical setup to project images coming from a
multimedia projector to certain surfaces, for instance a cylindrical
screen. I've been thinking about using mirrors for that instead of lenses,
since they seem to be cheaper and easier to work with (I can use polished
metal sheets, for instance).

I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

Thanks a lot for any help.
In technical terms, you want to bend the image plane.

The image plane must have a certain curvature.

Optical engineer's nightmare, they want flat image planes.

There exist panorama cameras with cylindrical film cassettes
and some are rotating the objective around a pivot, exposing the film
through a slit stop.
http://www.tbk.de/panorama/show1.htm

Put a 360° mirrored cone in front of the objective
for a 360 degrees fisheye view.
projection dome:
http://local.wasp.uwa.edu.au/~pbourke/projection/fisheye/

w.
Guest
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 7:31 am
On Feb 12, 2:02 pm, Bruno Barberi Gnecco
<brunobgDELETET...@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:
Quote:
        I need to design an optical setup to project images coming from a
multimedia projector to certain surfaces, for instance a cylindrical
screen. I've been thinking about using mirrors for that instead of lenses,
since they seem to be cheaper and easier to work with (I can use polished
metal sheets, for instance).

        I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

        Thanks a lot for any help.

Do you already have some experience at fabricating sheet metal into
optical surfaces? It is *much* easier to talk about it than to do it.
Forming sheet metal into simple but efficient light collecting shapes
(solar furnaces, condensor systems, etc.) is already a challenge.
Imaging is at least an order of magnitude tougher.

I don't want to discourage innovation and experimentation, but you
should know that for okay image reproduction, optical surfaces
typically must be accurately formed (figured) to within a small
handful of wavelengths of light. Thus, for yellow light (~0.59
microns), you might want to form your surface accurately to within
maybe 6 microns or less. That doesn't even take into account surface
finish requirements.

On the other hand, it sounds like you might have a fun project on your
hands.

Good luck!

Spencer
Bruno Barberi Gnecco
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:55 pm
Guest
mpate@oscintl.com wrote:
Quote:
I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

Thanks a lot for any help.


Check out Andy Hicks freeform optics design work at:
http://www.math.drexel.edu/~ahicks/
http://www.math.drexel.edu/~ahicks/design/

Michael
http://www.oscintl.com/Consulting/custom_fisheyes.htm

Thanks, I found a technical report by him that seems very
interesting, discussing different methods for calculating the mirror,
and which seems to be leading in the right direction.
Bruno Barberi Gnecco
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:10 pm
Guest
sluster@lw4u.com wrote:
Quote:
On Feb 12, 2:02 pm, Bruno Barberi Gnecco
brunobgDELETET...@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:

I need to design an optical setup to project images coming from a
multimedia projector to certain surfaces, for instance a cylindrical
screen. I've been thinking about using mirrors for that instead of lenses,
since they seem to be cheaper and easier to work with (I can use polished
metal sheets, for instance).

I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

Thanks a lot for any help.


Do you already have some experience at fabricating sheet metal into
optical surfaces? It is *much* easier to talk about it than to do it.
Forming sheet metal into simple but efficient light collecting shapes
(solar furnaces, condensor systems, etc.) is already a challenge.
Imaging is at least an order of magnitude tougher.

I was expecting to either deform thin sheets previously polished
or coated with a reflexive material, or to coat them later. From earlier
calculations and tests it seems that the surfaces won't be too
complicated to shape, and I've been talking to people who have made
mirrors before. The overall opinion is that, for the quality I'm
aiming (not a telescope, but a simple projection system) I should
be able to achive the quality necessary.

Any tips, comments or "I've tried that and it doesn't work"
advice?

Quote:
I don't want to discourage innovation and experimentation, but you
should know that for okay image reproduction, optical surfaces
typically must be accurately formed (figured) to within a small
handful of wavelengths of light. Thus, for yellow light (~0.59
microns), you might want to form your surface accurately to within
maybe 6 microns or less. That doesn't even take into account surface
finish requirements.

On the other hand, it sounds like you might have a fun project on your
hands.

I understand that, but I think that your figure of 6 microns
for surface accuracy is way too much for my needs. I agree that I need
a very good coating, plain and uniform, to get decent reflection without
too much aberration and light dispersion, but I think the results will
be satisfactory if the surface is off from the design for as much
as 200um as long as it's smooth. Remember that I'm using the mirror to
project onto a large screen far away from the user; imperfections of up
to a few % on the final image will not be noticeable.

It's fun but it's challenging Smile
Guest
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 5:56 am
On Feb 13, 9:10 pm, Bruno Barberi Gnecco
<brunobgDELETET...@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:
Quote:
slus...@lw4u.com wrote:
On Feb 12, 2:02 pm, Bruno Barberi Gnecco
brunobgDELETET...@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:

       I need to design an optical setup to project images coming from a
multimedia projector to certain surfaces, for instance a cylindrical
screen. I've been thinking about using mirrors for that instead of lenses,
since they seem to be cheaper and easier to work with (I can use polished
metal sheets, for instance).

       I'm looking for books or other material that help me design these
optical systems. I'm particularly worried about keeping image focus across
the screen. Any recommendations? Any practical advice?

       Thanks a lot for any help.

Do you already have some experience at fabricating sheet metal into
optical surfaces? It is *much* easier to talk about it than to do it.
Forming sheet metal into simple but efficient light collecting shapes
(solar furnaces, condensor systems, etc.) is already a challenge.
Imaging is at least an order of magnitude tougher.

        I was expecting to either deform thin sheets previously polished
or coated with a reflexive material, or to coat them later. From earlier
calculations and tests it seems that the surfaces won't be too
complicated to shape, and I've been talking to people who have made
mirrors before. The overall opinion is that, for the quality I'm
aiming (not a telescope, but a simple projection system) I should
be able to achive the quality necessary.

        Any tips, comments or "I've tried that and it doesn't work"
advice?

I don't want to discourage innovation and experimentation, but you
should know that for okay image reproduction, optical surfaces
typically must be accurately formed (figured) to within a small
handful of wavelengths of light. Thus, for yellow light (~0.59
microns), you might want to form your surface accurately to within
maybe 6 microns or less. That doesn't even take into account surface
finish requirements.

On the other hand, it sounds like you might have a fun project on your
hands.

        I understand that, but I think that your figure of 6 microns
for surface accuracy is way too much for my needs. I agree that I need
a very good coating, plain and uniform, to get decent reflection without
too much aberration and light dispersion, but I think the results will
be satisfactory if the surface is off from the design for as much
as 200um as long as it's smooth. Remember that I'm using the mirror to
project onto a large screen far away from the user; imperfections of up
to a few % on the final image will not be noticeable.

        It's fun but it's challenging Smile- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Roger that about your allowed errors. I understand.

The only tip I can think of immediately is that if you want to do a
quick and dirty test of a surface that is generated by bending a plane
(any kind of cylinder, for example), you could put a layer of
aluminized mylar over it. Think high-end party balloons (the inside
surface is smooth and shiny), or certain kinds of holiday wrapping
paper, with the backside being plain and aluminized. I've done this
before when making a tube with a smooth and highly reflective ID. For
temporary testing, put a thin coating of oil in the surface to be
covered, then carefully spread the mylar over it. The oil provides
enough adhesion, while still letting you shift and smooth the
material, unlike the case with any true adhesives.

Good luck!

Spencer
 
Page 1 of 1       All times are GMT - 5 Hours
The time now is Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:33 pm