Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

Thu, 22 Jan 2004 11:37:51 +0100: Hugo Coolens <hugocoolens@skynet.be>:
in sci.lang:

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I first thought you meant different verb stems of the same root, but
now I think you don't. So where you write 'stem' you really mean
'root"?
Verb stems I have seen indciated by roman numerals.

I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

Probably just a transliteration scheme. The Arabic alphabet has
letters the Latin alphabet lacks. 3 and 9 vaguely resemble forms of
the Arabic letter `ain, or of phonetic symbols for its sounds.

7 may
be used for the emphatic h, because the [h] is also a sound of the
Arabic language, and a letter in the alphabet. And it sounds very
different.

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?
I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

Ruud Harmsen wrote:

Thu, 22 Jan 2004 11:37:51 +0100: Hugo Coolens <hugocoolens@skynet.be>:
in sci.lang:

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I first thought you meant different verb stems of the same root, but
now I think you don't. So where you write 'stem' you really mean
'root"?
Verb stems I have seen indciated by roman numerals.

I just used "to stem from" to say "to come from", sorry for the confusion

I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

Probably just a transliteration scheme. The Arabic alphabet has
letters the Latin alphabet lacks. 3 and 9 vaguely resemble forms of
the Arabic letter `ain, or of phonetic symbols for its sounds.

OK, they look indeed a bit like the _mirrored_ glyph of `ayn

7 may
be used for the emphatic h, because the [h] is also a sound of the
Arabic language, and a letter in the alphabet. And it sounds very
different.

but why 7 for emphatic h? Do you think also because of resemblance with
the corresponding glyph in this case?

I also wonder whether other numbers are also used for other characters?

Ruud Harmsen wrote:

Thu, 22 Jan 2004 11:37:51 +0100: Hugo Coolens <hugocoolens@skynet.be>:
in sci.lang:

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I first thought you meant different verb stems of the same root, but
now I think you don't. So where you write 'stem' you really mean
'root"?
Verb stems I have seen indciated by roman numerals.

I just used "to stem from" to say "to come from", sorry for the confusion

Thu, 22 Jan 2004 13:58:21 +0100: Hugo Coolens <hugocoolens@skynet.be>:
in sci.lang:

Ruud Harmsen wrote:

Thu, 22 Jan 2004 11:37:51 +0100: Hugo Coolens <hugocoolens@skynet.be>:
in sci.lang:

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I first thought you meant different verb stems of the same root, but
now I think you don't. So where you write 'stem' you really mean
'root"?
Verb stems I have seen indciated by roman numerals.

I just used "to stem from" to say "to come from", sorry for the confusion

Ah, yes, I misread you, my mistake. Sorry.

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)

Arabic stems from?

I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

regards,
Hugo

Does anyone know where the use of numbers to transcribe (colloquial)
Arabic stems from?

I have seen 3 and 9 used as a means to represent ''ayn
I also saw 7 used for H like in 7abib, a7la

Why exactly do they use 7 for H and 3 or 9 for ''ayn?

Are you too young to remember typewriters? They were mechanical devices
.....
This was not restricted to Colloquial Arabic.

If they used 7 for H, that means they didn't even have an underdot
character -- what did they use for the other letters traditionally
transliterated using an underdot?

Are you too young to remember typewriters? They were mechanical devices
for imitating "printing" at home, and even the largest of them couldn't
accommodate more than 92 different characters (84 and 88 were more
typical, on 42 or 44 keys). That means there was very little opportunity
to replace less-used characters with ones needed by Arabists, so
recourse was had to number-keys to stand for letters they somewhat
resembled.

Not to mention using the LETTER key <lower-case L> to print the NUMBER
1>.
Please don't tell me I'm the only one who had a typewriter without a 1
key.
And lacking a 1/! key, the only way to type an exclamation point was
apostrophe-backspace-period. There were ingenious ways to center and
justify
text and create tables, complete with vertical and horizontal lines.

"Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:400FCA83.2740@worldnet.att.net...

Are you too young to remember typewriters? They were mechanical devices
for imitating "printing" at home, and even the largest of them couldn't
accommodate more than 92 different characters (84 and 88 were more
typical, on 42 or 44 keys). That means there was very little opportunity
to replace less-used characters with ones needed by Arabists, so
recourse was had to number-keys to stand for letters they somewhat
resembled.

Not to mention using the LETTER key <lower-case L> to print the NUMBER <1>.
Please don't tell me I'm the only one who had a typewriter without a 1 key.
And lacking a 1/! key, the only way to type an exclamation point was
apostrophe-backspace-period. There were ingenious ways to center and justify
text and create tables, complete with vertical and horizontal lines.

"Avi Jacobson" <avi-j@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:pAmQb.5368$HJ2.1256@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...

Not to mention using the LETTER key <lower-case L> to print the NUMBER
1>.
Please don't tell me I'm the only one who had a typewriter without a 1
key.
And lacking a 1/! key, the only way to type an exclamation point was
apostrophe-backspace-period. There were ingenious ways to center and
justify
text and create tables, complete with vertical and horizontal lines.

Ok, I owned a typewriter without numeral-1, where one used a lowercase-l (L)
but never one without an "exclamation point." <Grin

So where was the exclamation point? Typewriters that have them put them
on the 1 key. You had to do without something else in order to get a
dedicated exclamation point.

Herb Martin wrote:

"Avi Jacobson" <avi-j@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:pAmQb.5368$HJ2.1256@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...

Not to mention using the LETTER key <lower-case L> to print the NUMBER
1>.
Please don't tell me I'm the only one who had a typewriter without a 1
key.
And lacking a 1/! key, the only way to type an exclamation point was
apostrophe-backspace-period. There were ingenious ways to center and
justify
text and create tables, complete with vertical and horizontal lines.

Ok, I owned a typewriter without numeral-1, where one used a lowercase-l
(L)
but never one without an "exclamation point." <Grin


BTW people still type "l" for "1"; you can see it in typeset books all
the time.
--
Peter T. Daniels grammatim@att.net