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Sylvia Else...
Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:04 pm
 
Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

<http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx>

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.
 
Peter Bowditch...
Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:34 am
 
Sylvia Else <sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

[quote]Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.
[/quote]
Unfortunately, I think the Power Bangle crooks have won.

Here is a collection of things I have had to say about this scam.

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/powerbalance.htm

--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
I'm at (no spam) RatbagsDotCom on Twitter
 
Martin...
Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:53 pm
 
On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
<sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

[quote]Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.
[/quote]
This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.
 
Sylvia Else...
Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:43 pm
 
On 28/10/2010 5:53 AM, Martin wrote:
[quote]On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.

This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.
[/quote]
In his book "The Demon Haunted World" Carl Saga describes how Randi and
the Australian TV program Sixty Minutes showed how easy it was to create
a public presence for a psychic. The 'psychic' was simply someone known
to Randi who took his speaking cues from Randi via a hidden earpiece.

Anyway, Sagan made the point that even after the whole thing had been
exposed, including that the psychic himself was, by his own admission,
in on the scam, old ladies were still approaching him and saying "Don't
worry about what they say - we still believe in you."

Clearly it's never going to be possible to eliminate paranormal beliefs
because some people are just too stupid to understand even the simplest
of disproofs - including actual admissions of duplicity on the part of
those previously claiming to have powers.

Some people seem to have such a tenuous grasp of reality that one has to
wonder how they manage to function in our world.

Sylvia.
 
Peter Bowditch...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:02 am
 
Sylvia Else <sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

[quote]On 28/10/2010 5:53 AM, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.

This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.

In his book "The Demon Haunted World" Carl Saga describes how Randi and
the Australian TV program Sixty Minutes showed how easy it was to create
a public presence for a psychic. The 'psychic' was simply someone known
to Randi who took his speaking cues from Randi via a hidden earpiece.

Anyway, Sagan made the point that even after the whole thing had been
exposed, including that the psychic himself was, by his own admission,
in on the scam, old ladies were still approaching him and saying "Don't
worry about what they say - we still believe in you."

Clearly it's never going to be possible to eliminate paranormal beliefs
because some people are just too stupid to understand even the simplest
of disproofs - including actual admissions of duplicity on the part of
those previously claiming to have powers.

Some people seem to have such a tenuous grasp of reality that one has to
wonder how they manage to function in our world.

Sylvia.
[/quote]
I participated in a pilot for a TV show once where a friend of mine
did a psychic act. She read three people in the audience, telling one
of them that he had two daughters, had been in the army and that his
father had died relatively recently. Correct! She told the next person
that he had three children, had been born in South America (he had a
very pale, pure English complexion) and worked in IT. Correct! After
she had finished reading me and her husband she did a cold read of
some woman in the audience.

She then announced that she had known one of the readees for many
years, was married to one, and had simply done a standard cold read of
the other.

A woman in the row behind me tapped me on the shoulder and asked if
Alynda really did know me and was David really her husband.(*) When I
said "Yes", she said "She's really good, isn't she?".

I have another friend who does a psychic act based on a system she
invented herself called "Tauromancy". Despite working under a sign
which says "Fake Psychic, Readings $0" she inevitably gets people
offering her money for her remarkably accurate cold reads.

(*) There is a video floating around of me doing a Benny Hinn style
healing of Alynda, where I hit her on the forehead and she falls over.
That would be just boring, except that she is a practitioner of some
martial arts and has the ability to fall over backwards and
immediately rise to her feet again, like those punching dolls with
sand in the bottom.

In the video I say that I am about to "cure this woman of the sin of
lust". Her husband can be heard faintly calling out from the audience
"No, you are not".

--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
I'm at (no spam) RatbagsDotCom on Twitter
 
Sylvia Else...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:25 am
 
On 28/10/2010 8:02 PM, Peter Bowditch wrote:
[quote]
A woman in the row behind me tapped me on the shoulder and asked if
Alynda really did know me and was David really her husband.(*) When I
said "Yes", she said "She's really good, isn't she?".
[/quote]
LOL.

Sylvia.
 
BruceS...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 9:13 am
 
On Oct 28, 10:34 am, Martin <n... at (no spam) nowhere.com> wrote:
[quote]On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 10:43:21 +1100, Sylvia Else



syl... at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:
On 28/10/2010 5:53 AM, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
syl... at (no spam) not.here.invalid>  wrote:

Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet  – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/S...

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.

This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.

In his book "The Demon Haunted World" Carl Saga describes how Randi and
the Australian TV program Sixty Minutes showed how easy it was to create
a public presence for a psychic. The 'psychic' was simply someone known
to Randi who took his speaking cues from Randi via a hidden earpiece.

I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly :-)

Anyway, Sagan made the point that even after the whole thing had been
exposed, including that the psychic himself was, by his own admission,
in on the scam, old ladies were still approaching him and saying "Don't
worry about what they say - we still believe in you."

I' m familiar with that. I perform mentalism and do theatrical
recreations of seances. I usually ask which part of the words 'show'
and 'theatre' they don't understand. Disclaimers are a hot topic among
mentalists, but I don't bother with them. I found them to be totally
ineffective for the people they're intended for.
[/quote]
Consider that to someone like me, the disclaimer would make it clear
that you're not a fraud.
This whole thread has been hilarious. My thanks to all involved.

[quote]Clearly it's never going to be possible to eliminate paranormal beliefs
because some people are just too stupid to understand even the simplest
of disproofs - including actual admissions of duplicity on the part of
those previously claiming to have powers.

Of course they would deny it all in public! If they didn't, they'd be
kidnapped by the CIA and put to work in one of those secret
underground bases.
[/quote]
Only if the CIA has the sort of reality-challenged people that seem to
infest this ng.
<snip>
 
george...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 9:28 am
 
On Oct 28, 10:02 pm, Peter Bowditch <myfirstn... at (no spam) ratbags.com> wrote:

[quote]In the video I say that I am about to "cure this woman of the sin of
lust". Her husband can be heard faintly calling out from the audience
"No, you are not".
[/quote]
Love it...
What, incidentally, was the audience reaction ?
I know what my reaction would be..
Falling down laughing
 
Martin...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:34 am
 
On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 10:43:21 +1100, Sylvia Else
<sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

[quote]On 28/10/2010 5:53 AM, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.

This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.

In his book "The Demon Haunted World" Carl Saga describes how Randi and
the Australian TV program Sixty Minutes showed how easy it was to create
a public presence for a psychic. The 'psychic' was simply someone known
to Randi who took his speaking cues from Randi via a hidden earpiece.
[/quote]
I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly :-)

[quote]Anyway, Sagan made the point that even after the whole thing had been
exposed, including that the psychic himself was, by his own admission,
in on the scam, old ladies were still approaching him and saying "Don't
worry about what they say - we still believe in you."
[/quote]
I' m familiar with that. I perform mentalism and do theatrical
recreations of seances. I usually ask which part of the words 'show'
and 'theatre' they don't understand. Disclaimers are a hot topic among
mentalists, but I don't bother with them. I found them to be totally
ineffective for the people they're intended for.

[quote]Clearly it's never going to be possible to eliminate paranormal beliefs
because some people are just too stupid to understand even the simplest
of disproofs - including actual admissions of duplicity on the part of
those previously claiming to have powers.
[/quote]
Of course they would deny it all in public! If they didn't, they'd be
kidnapped by the CIA and put to work in one of those secret
underground bases.

[quote]Some people seem to have such a tenuous grasp of reality that one has to
wonder how they manage to function in our world.
[/quote]
Yes, I find that amazing as well. The ones you see on the net are
clearly capable of operating a computer (at the user level at least),
they can read and write, but at the same time they demonstrate they
don't know simple and basic things about the world around them. A
worthy research subject I think.

>Sylvia.
 
Martin...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:41 am
 
On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 20:02:56 +1100, Peter Bowditch
<myfirstname at (no spam) ratbags.com> wrote:

[quote]Sylvia Else <sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

On 28/10/2010 5:53 AM, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 13:04:34 +1100, Sylvia Else
sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

Hey - my first ever Usenet ping.

I was struck by the following comment from Choice Magazine in discussion
about the Shonky Awards:

"With some reluctance, we highlight the inherent shonkiness of the Power
Balance bracelet – reluctance, because when Australian Skeptics
demonstrated on Today Tonight that it patently didn’t do anything,
subsequent sales skyrocketed: apparently any publicity is good publicity
after all."

http://www.choice.com.au/Reviews-and-Tests/Money/Shopping-and-Legal/Shopping/The-2010-Shonky-Awards/page/The-shonkiest-products.aspx

I can imagine the people at Australian Skeptics shaking their heads in
disbelief. It appears that Today Tonight viewers are much like Herc;
completely impervious to any sort of disproof, preferring to believe the
highly implausible.

Sylvia.

This always reminded of when Randi showed what a fraud Peter Popoff is
on national television. After the show the network got loads of calls
from people asking where they could find this wonderful faith healer.

In his book "The Demon Haunted World" Carl Saga describes how Randi and
the Australian TV program Sixty Minutes showed how easy it was to create
a public presence for a psychic. The 'psychic' was simply someone known
to Randi who took his speaking cues from Randi via a hidden earpiece.

Anyway, Sagan made the point that even after the whole thing had been
exposed, including that the psychic himself was, by his own admission,
in on the scam, old ladies were still approaching him and saying "Don't
worry about what they say - we still believe in you."

Clearly it's never going to be possible to eliminate paranormal beliefs
because some people are just too stupid to understand even the simplest
of disproofs - including actual admissions of duplicity on the part of
those previously claiming to have powers.

Some people seem to have such a tenuous grasp of reality that one has to
wonder how they manage to function in our world.

Sylvia.

I participated in a pilot for a TV show once where a friend of mine
did a psychic act. She read three people in the audience, telling one
of them that he had two daughters, had been in the army and that his
father had died relatively recently. Correct! She told the next person
that he had three children, had been born in South America (he had a
very pale, pure English complexion) and worked in IT. Correct! After
she had finished reading me and her husband she did a cold read of
some woman in the audience.

She then announced that she had known one of the readees for many
years, was married to one, and had simply done a standard cold read of
the other.

A woman in the row behind me tapped me on the shoulder and asked if
Alynda really did know me and was David really her husband.(*) When I
said "Yes", she said "She's really good, isn't she?".

I have another friend who does a psychic act based on a system she
invented herself called "Tauromancy". Despite working under a sign
which says "Fake Psychic, Readings $0" she inevitably gets people
offering her money for her remarkably accurate cold reads.
[/quote]
I suppose you know who Harriet Hall is. In one her lectures she said
she once invented her own system of astrology. The signs were
household items. She had a chart of the sky were she had drawn a
vacuumcleaner through some stars, a telephone, a refridgerator etc.
People born under the sign of the vacuumcleaner (or hoover, if you
like) tend to be homely and clean, people born under the sign of the
telephone are very talkative etc. She did this trying to show some
people in her readingclub that you can make up anything using the
stars and that astrology (as we know it) is similarly made up. But of
course the women in the readingclub wanted her to make their
horoscopes using her system, because it sounded so accurate.

[quote](*) There is a video floating around of me doing a Benny Hinn style
healing of Alynda, where I hit her on the forehead and she falls over.
That would be just boring, except that she is a practitioner of some
martial arts and has the ability to fall over backwards and
immediately rise to her feet again, like those punching dolls with
sand in the bottom.

In the video I say that I am about to "cure this woman of the sin of
lust". Her husband can be heard faintly calling out from the audience
"No, you are not".[/quote]
 
Sylvia Else...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:45 pm
 
On 29/10/2010 3:34 AM, Martin wrote:

[quote]I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly Smile
[/quote]
Yes, Carlos.

Now that I've found my copy of Sagan's book, I can quote it accurately.
He said that the person playing Carlos, Jose Luis Alvarez, was a
performance sculptor who was Randi's tenant.

Sylvia.
 
Peter Bowditch...
Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 11:02 pm
 
george <gblack at (no spam) hnpl.net> wrote:

[quote]On Oct 28, 10:02 pm, Peter Bowditch <myfirstn... at (no spam) ratbags.com> wrote:

In the video I say that I am about to "cure this woman of the sin of
lust". Her husband can be heard faintly calling out from the audience
"No, you are not".

Love it...
What, incidentally, was the audience reaction ?
I know what my reaction would be..
Falling down laughing
[/quote]
That was about what happened.

--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
I'm at (no spam) RatbagsDotCom on Twitter
 
Peter Bowditch...
Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 6:43 am
 
Sylvia Else <sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

[quote]On 29/10/2010 3:34 AM, Martin wrote:

I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly :-)

Yes, Carlos.

Now that I've found my copy of Sagan's book, I can quote it accurately.
He said that the person playing Carlos, Jose Luis Alvarez, was a
performance sculptor who was Randi's tenant.
[/quote]
Sagan was being polite in order to stop the Randi haters from
screeching irrelevancies.

--
Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com
I'm at (no spam) RatbagsDotCom on Twitter
 
Sylvia Else...
Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:03 am
 
On 29/10/2010 11:43 PM, Peter Bowditch wrote:
[quote]Sylvia Else<sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

On 29/10/2010 3:34 AM, Martin wrote:

I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly :-)

Yes, Carlos.

Now that I've found my copy of Sagan's book, I can quote it accurately.
He said that the person playing Carlos, Jose Luis Alvarez, was a
performance sculptor who was Randi's tenant.

Sagan was being polite in order to stop the Randi haters from
screeching irrelevancies.

[/quote]
So what was the truth?

Sylvia.
 
Sylvia Else...
Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:04 am
 
On 30/10/2010 12:03 AM, Sylvia Else wrote:
[quote]On 29/10/2010 11:43 PM, Peter Bowditch wrote:
Sylvia Else<sylvia at (no spam) not.here.invalid> wrote:

On 29/10/2010 3:34 AM, Martin wrote:

I take it you're talking about Carlos.
Calling him 'someone known' to Randi is putting it mildly :-)

Yes, Carlos.

Now that I've found my copy of Sagan's book, I can quote it accurately.
He said that the person playing Carlos, Jose Luis Alvarez, was a
performance sculptor who was Randi's tenant.

Sagan was being polite in order to stop the Randi haters from
screeching irrelevancies.


So what was the truth?

Sylvia.
[/quote]
Oh, OK "tenant".

Yes, I think I know what is meant, and it would indeed have been an
irrelevancy.

Sylvia.
 
 
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