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| xinixx... |
 Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 5:01 am |
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Hi there I'm breeding Eikenburgers a kind of white Sebrights but i
have quitte a lot of infertile eggs the strange thing is, like
Sebrights i thought the roosters need better spring temperatures for
better fertillety.
But early layed spring eggs proved to be fertile, and as summer passed
along the number of infertile eggs grew. better hardly any fertille
eggs
I know Infertlillety can be caused by several reasons like bad rooster
condition, lot of feathers near the cloaca or heavy weight of the
rooster or large spurs or just fancy one particular hen and in this
way not mating the other hens.
I'm puzzled for none of the above reasons i recognise as a possible
cause . The pens are large, the condition of the animals i very good
as far as i can judge, for the hens lay plenty of eggs and the
roosters do mate with all hens,
There is one pen that produce some more fertile eggs then the other
pens. In this pen the gras is less taller then in the others. Can it
be that tall growing gras/ weeds in the pen can be the cause of bad
fertillety? For i thought might it be possible the tall grasses might
prevent a good mating for the gras/weeds are just in the roosters way
he needs some (more) open space, clear ground to do his little dance
and approcing the hen?
Their is an abundance of growing weeds and grasses in the pens (they
love it for they always find some little insects their ect) the only
pure open and clear soil is just near and under their nightshelter/
henhouse. (They can have a dustbath there).
Anyone knowing more about this?
greetings xinixx |
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| Jill... |
| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2009 12:39 am |
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xinixx wrote:
[quote:0ad816c5d2]Hi there I'm breeding Eikenburgers a kind of white Sebrights but i
have quitte a lot of infertile eggs the strange thing is, like
Sebrights i thought the roosters need better spring temperatures for
better fertillety.
But early layed spring eggs proved to be fertile, and as summer passed
along the number of infertile eggs grew. better hardly any fertille
eggs
I know Infertlillety can be caused by several reasons like bad rooster
condition, lot of feathers near the cloaca or heavy weight of the
rooster or large spurs or just fancy one particular hen and in this
way not mating the other hens.
[/quote:0ad816c5d2]
There is also a disease challenge possibility.
Maybe they have had a passing infection, that left its mark?
Mycoplasma can be a mild infection outwardly, but can significantly affect
the egg production and female fertility mechanisms.
for instance
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3411710
Infectious Bronchitis can be similarly not clinically a major event in
healthy birds but has a profound affect on fertility.
for instance
http://www.bioone.org/doi/abs/10.1637/7815-121306-REGR4.1?journalCode=avdi
It is possible that it is your girls that are at fault, have you put him in
with other hens and tested their fertility (even if you throw the eggs away
after 10 days) ?
Can you get your birds tested - even if its just a simple, and not overly
sensitive, PLATE test for the likes of IB, myco, etc
As to your long grass, just strim out a "dancing" patch, and see if that
helps <g>
--
regards
Jill Bowis
Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk |
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| stud... |
| Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:11 pm |
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Thanks for the advice I've not tested the hens yet for they did not to
have been sick that i can remember. Last monday 4 eggs hatched. While
Eikenburgers beeing are rare breed i kept on collecting eggs for the
incubator. These are the last i've been collecting before autum/
winter comes. Afther so manny infertile eggs i was a bit amased these
late ones being fertile so late in season. |
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| Jill... |
| Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:00 am |
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stud wrote:
[quote:533abfd1d8]Thanks for the advice I've not tested the hens yet for they did not to
have been sick that i can remember.
[/quote:533abfd1d8]
It can be a passing challenge.
Healthy birds can show no outward signs sometimes.
Last monday 4 eggs hatched.
yipppeeeee
While
[quote:533abfd1d8]Eikenburgers beeing are rare breed
[/quote:533abfd1d8]
cute little burgers !!!! VERY true bantam in type and attitude <g>
--
regards
Jill Bowis
Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk |
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| Jill... |
| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:55 am |
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Grizzly wrote:
[quote:7ddff8de20]
Thank you for that background history. Here's wishing you the best
of luck with your breeding program. And I so agree, breed for
health and "fitness" first and foremost. Too many creatures - dogs
and cats in particular - have been ruined by ridiculous anti-health
standards being the main aim of breeders.
This discussion having piqued my curiosity I just *had* to search
for pictures of them online and was delighted with what I saw. Pretty
little creatures, aren't they! Lovely elegant lines.
A L P
While the breed is "rare" the fertility problems that crop up are most
likely due to inbreeding. One of the best ways to open a line back up
and make it fertile is to outcross with another breed that has similar
traits and characteristics. While "purists" frown upon this it is
exactly what the doctor orders if you want those hatch rates to
improve. A dear friend of mine had similar fertility problems with
her Denizli longcrowers. She was able to improve hatch to 90% by
outcrossing with Egyptian Fayoumi lines. It was then a simple matter
[/quote:7ddff8de20]
not always so simple 
Out crossing is exactly how so many breeds have been effectively lost or
nearly lost altogether.
Unless a breeder can keep control of every one of their birds until every
scrap of the out cross is gone, then its always a danger.
but you are right - infertility is a serious problem in so many close
strains.
--
regards
Jill Bowis
Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk |
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| Jill... |
| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 2:19 pm |
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Guest
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"Grizzly" <NoOne at (no spam) nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u9Zgm.2399$cW.1401 at (no spam) newsreading01.news.tds.net...
[quote:8e6496c89b]
The outcross my friend chose turned out to be the stock from which the
Denizli longcrowers descended. This was proven through genetyping at UW
Madison. They were doing studies of the genetic variability in poultry and
found the Fayoumi and Denizli to be so similar that they had to be close
relatives of one another.
[/quote:8e6496c89b]
oh , nice one.
Its a shame there is not more work like this going on.
Great to see it, and the results are obvious from your friends results.
mind you with those rather less attractive characteristics one might
sometimes questions why ? <grin>
lethal genes, cannibalistic, noisy, wild !!!!!!
ah well, I find the stretchiness of the chicken genome absolutely
fascinating, what would man do without such a set of genetics to play with.
<giggle>
--
--
regards
Jill Bowis
Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk |
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| A _L_ P... |
| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 3:04 pm |
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Guest
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Jill wrote:
[quote:0de953b63f]"Grizzly" <NoOne at (no spam) nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u9Zgm.2399$cW.1401 at (no spam) newsreading01.news.tds.net...
The outcross my friend chose turned out to be the stock from which the
Denizli longcrowers descended. This was proven through genetyping at UW
Madison. They were doing studies of the genetic variability in poultry and
found the Fayoumi and Denizli to be so similar that they had to be close
relatives of one another.
oh , nice one.
Its a shame there is not more work like this going on.
Great to see it, and the results are obvious from your friends results.
mind you with those rather less attractive characteristics one might
sometimes questions why ? <grin
[/quote:0de953b63f]
Precisely my feelings when I was reading. The trouble I have had with
the Council after complaints by 1 or 2 neighbours! They'd REALLY know
what "noisy rooster" means if someone started breeding these in our
'hood :-)
Perhaps if I am forced to get rid of my boys I could order a CD of
"Denizli Vocal Gems" to play loudly by way of revenge.......
[quote:0de953b63f]lethal genes, cannibalistic, noisy, wild !!!!!!
ah well, I find the stretchiness of the chicken genome absolutely
fascinating, what would man do without such a set of genetics to play with.
giggle
A L P[/quote:0de953b63f]
[still scratching head; developing even deeper "why" wrinkles!] |
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| Grizzly... |
| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:57 pm |
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Guest
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A _L_ P wrote:
[quote:1b1348e04f]Jill wrote:
"Grizzly" <NoOne at (no spam) nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u9Zgm.2399$cW.1401 at (no spam) newsreading01.news.tds.net...
The outcross my friend chose turned out to be the stock from which
the Denizli longcrowers descended. This was proven through
genetyping at UW Madison. They were doing studies of the genetic
variability in poultry and found the Fayoumi and Denizli to be so
similar that they had to be close relatives of one another.
oh , nice one.
Its a shame there is not more work like this going on.
Great to see it, and the results are obvious from your friends results.
mind you with those rather less attractive characteristics one might
sometimes questions why ? <grin
Precisely my feelings when I was reading. The trouble I have had with
the Council after complaints by 1 or 2 neighbours! They'd REALLY know
what "noisy rooster" means if someone started breeding these in our
'hood :-)
Perhaps if I am forced to get rid of my boys I could order a CD of
"Denizli Vocal Gems" to play loudly by way of revenge.......
lethal genes, cannibalistic, noisy, wild !!!!!!
ah well, I find the stretchiness of the chicken genome absolutely
fascinating, what would man do without such a set of genetics to play
with. <giggle
A L P
[still scratching head; developing even deeper "why" wrinkles!]
[/quote:1b1348e04f]
Do a youtube search for Denizli Rooster and you will come up with a
chicken that wails like a Banshee! They breed these for the long crow.
It is well thought of by the Denizens of that particular area of
Turkey, and they have crowing contests..I don't know if there is money
involved, but I imagine there are bragging rights, and in that corner of
the planet those go a long way.. |
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| Jill... |
| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:12 am |
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A _L_ P wrote:
[quote:8170cfd7c1]
A L P
[still scratching head; developing even deeper "why" wrinkles!]
[/quote:8170cfd7c1]
hey -- its human !!!!!
just cos they can - they do
<g>
--
regards
Jill Bowis
Domestic Poultry and Waterfowl Solutions
Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine Nursery
Seasonal Farm Food
http://www.kintaline.co.uk |
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