All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis.

The Natural Products Association, a supplement trade group,
said the study "stands in stark contrast to large actual
clinical studies that have not demonstrated any increased risks".

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

*Organized medicine*.

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

"Mark Thorson" <nospam@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.


An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

"Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message

news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...





Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

What a fool.

vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

On Feb 28, 9:12 am, " Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

"Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message

news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...






Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

What a fool.


His mission in life is exploring the perils of good nutrition. His
"analysis" of a vitamin C abstract a few years ago was embarrassing.
He couldn't even get the study doses right.

"the team adds that they examined only the use of synthetic vitamins"
The Times Feb 28. page 7

even though the large photo shows natural source vit E! why do they
think anyone would
be particularly interested that a study suggests the use of chemicals
not found naturally in
living organisms could be detrimental to health.?

when this has been publicised many times before.

"and the findings should not be translated to fruits and vegetables"

why not?

vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

cos they are the same as the synthetic version?

PeterB wrote:
On Feb 28, 9:12 am, " Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

"Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message

news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

What a fool.

His mission in life is exploring the perils of good nutrition. His
"analysis" of a vitamin C abstract a few years ago was embarrassing.
He couldn't even get the study doses right.

Please Petey, do tell us again what vitamin C does in the cell. And how
we can't even breathe without vitamin C.

On Feb 28, 9:54 am, JohnDoe <d...@spam.me> wrote:
PeterB wrote:
On Feb 28, 9:12 am, " Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

"Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message

news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have
pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

What a fool.

His mission in life is exploring the perils of good nutrition. His
"analysis" of a vitamin C abstract a few years ago was embarrassing.
He couldn't even get the study doses right.

Please Petey, do tell us again what vitamin C does in the cell. And how
we can't even breathe without vitamin C.

Better yet, I invite you to perform the following experiment:

For 8 months, consume no vitamin C whatsoever.
On day 244, let us know how your breathing has progressed.

Deal?

On Feb 28, 8:47 am, "Alex" <harvey.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
"the team adds that they examined only the use of synthetic vitamins"
The Times Feb 28. page 7

even though the large photo shows natural source vit E! why do they
think anyone would
be particularly interested that a study suggests the use of chemicals
not found naturally in
living organisms could be detrimental to health.?

when this has been publicised many times before.

"and the findings should not be translated to fruits and vegetables"

why not?

vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

cos they are the same as the synthetic version?

Nice find and use of logic Alex...sounds like the thread name should
changed to "synthetic antioxidants KILL!!!!"

"PeterB" <p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote in message

news:1172677778.888195.171460@t69g2000cwt.googlegroups.com...





On Feb 28, 9:54 am, JohnDoe <d...@spam.me> wrote:
PeterB wrote:
On Feb 28, 9:12 am, " Vernon" <stillhere@there> wrote:

"Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message

news:45E4EC50.798B4499@sonic.net...

Quoting from
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/297/8/842

Mortality in Randomized Trials of Antioxidant Supplements
for Primary and Secondary Prevention
Goran Bjelakovic, MD, DrMedSci; Dimitrinka Nikolova, MA;
Lise Lotte Gluud, MD, DrMedSci; Rosa G. Simonetti, MD;
Christian Gluud, MD, DrMedSci
JAMA. 2007;297:842-857.

Context: Antioxidant supplements are used for prevention
of several diseases.

Objective: To assess the effect of antioxidant supplements
on mortality in randomized primary and secondary prevention
trials.

Data Sources and Trial Selection: We searched electronic
databases and bibliographies published by October 2005.
All randomized trials involving adults comparing beta
carotene, vitamin A, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), vitamin E,
and selenium either singly or combined vs placebo or vs
no intervention were included in our analysis. Randomization,
blinding, and follow-up were considered markers of bias
in the included trials. The effect of antioxidant
supplements on all-cause mortality was analyzed with
random-effects meta-analyses and reported as relative
risk (RR) with 95% confidence intervals (CIs).
Meta-regression was used to assess the effect of covariates
across the trials.

Data Extraction: We included 68 randomized trials with
232606 participants (385 publications).

Data Synthesis: When all low- and high-bias risk trials
of antioxidant supplements were pooled together there
was no significant effect on mortality (RR, 1.02; 95% CI,
0.98-1.06). Multivariate meta-regression analyses
showed that low-bias risk trials (RR, 1.16; 95% CI,
1.05-1.29) and selenium (RR, 0.998; 95% CI, 0.997-0.9995)
were significantly associated with mortality. In 47 low-bias
trials with 180 938 participants, the antioxidant
supplements significantly increased mortality (RR, 1.05;
95% CI, 1.02-1.0. In low-bias risk trials, after exclusion
of selenium trials, beta carotene (RR, 1.07; 95% CI,
1.02-1.11), vitamin A (RR, 1.16; 95% CI, 1.10-1.24), and
vitamin E (RR, 1.04; 95% CI, 1.01-1.07), singly or combined,
significantly increased mortality. Vitamin C and selenium
had no significant effect on mortality.

Conclusions: Treatment with beta carotene, vitamin A, and
vitamin E may increase mortality. The potential roles of
vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

An equal in logic.
Showing the absolute and total scientific ignorance of those who even
publish this ignorance.

A large percentage of people who take NSAIDS have been shown to have
pains
from bruises and accidents; Therefore, taking NSAIDS increases the
likelihood of accidents.

What a fool.

His mission in life is exploring the perils of good nutrition. His
"analysis" of a vitamin C abstract a few years ago was embarrassing.
He couldn't even get the study doses right.

Please Petey, do tell us again what vitamin C does in the cell. And how
we can't even breathe without vitamin C.

Better yet, I invite you to perform the following experiment:

For 8 months, consume no vitamin C whatsoever.
On day 244, let us know how your breathing has progressed.

Deal?

He is supposed to count to 244? Get real.
Actually, with "NO" C, it is difficult to imagine 24 days.

"BrentB" <borgersbrent@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1172675982.926968.298190@8g2000cwh.googlegroups.com...
On Feb 28, 8:47 am, "Alex" <harvey.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
"the team adds that they examined only the use of synthetic vitamins"
The Times Feb 28. page 7

even though the large photo shows natural source vit E! why do they
think anyone would
be particularly interested that a study suggests the use of chemicals
not found naturally in
living organisms could be detrimental to health.?

when this has been publicised many times before.

"and the findings should not be translated to fruits and vegetables"

why not?

vitamin C and selenium on mortality need further study.

cos they are the same as the synthetic version?

Nice find and use of logic Alex...sounds like the thread name should
changed to "synthetic antioxidants KILL!!!!"


No, It should be bound and published for mandatory use in two college
courses, Logic and Journalism.

The message remains that a better diet trumps any usual or affordable