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Science Forum Index » Anthropology - Paleo Forum » Are you a RACIST?
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| jer453 |
 Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 3:31 am |
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Guest
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If you denounce racism, you should at least know what you're talking
about. We as human beings exist BECAUSE of Nature's racism. Nature
produces an infinite diversity of biological forms that struggle for
existence with the most fit becoming the victors in that struggle.
Racism is the key to Evolution. The USA owes its very existence to
Nature's racist principles. When Europeans "discovered" the Americas
the natural struggle for existence ensued. Our ancestors slaughtered
the native Indians to the tune "the only good Indian is a DEAD
Indian" and the "Manifest Destiny" mantra. Having been robbed of all
their lands and beaten into total submission they were confined to
concentration camps called "Reservations". The USA broke every treaty
it ever made with the natives. Taken in toto (including Negro
Slavery), it spelled RACISM at the MAX. If you wish to denounce
racism, at least be fair. You must denounce your own country that was
founded on ultra racism, and you, the recipient of stolen property,
are duty bound to return "your" property to the few surviving Native
Americans. Failing that, you should at least stop ranting against
racism and acknowledge that you, yourself, are a bountiful beneficiary
of the rich rewards of racism. There were no gods or God until human
beings created them. Nature created man, and man created gods. It's
a simple as that. For more info, please see: http://www.glorentz.com |
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| avgilbert@clearwire.net |
| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 6:25 pm |
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About all I can say to this is, this post is kind of confused.
"Nature" doesn't practice "racism". Evolution isn't the same thing.
Evolution just *is*. "Fitness" is a *biological* term referring to
reproductive success, not some "superioirty" that people sometimes
confer on themselves. As for the European variety of colonialism/
racism, this is a relatively(within the last 400-500 years or
so)development, hardly a "natural" one.
Anne Gilbert
P.S., folks, I haven't posted here for a long time, but I'm back now.
On Feb 3, 11:31 pm, "jer453" <lorentzg...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
Quote: If you denounce racism, you should at least know what you're talking
about. We as human beings exist BECAUSE of Nature's racism. Nature
produces an infinite diversity of biological forms that struggle for
existence with the most fit becoming the victors in that struggle.
Racism is the key to Evolution. The USA owes its very existence to
Nature's racist principles. When Europeans "discovered" the Americas
the natural struggle for existence ensued. Our ancestors slaughtered
the native Indians to the tune "the only good Indian is a DEAD
Indian" and the "Manifest Destiny" mantra. Having been robbed of all
their lands and beaten into total submission they were confined to
concentration camps called "Reservations". The USA broke every treaty
it ever made with the natives. Taken in toto (including Negro
Slavery), it spelled RACISM at the MAX. If you wish to denounce
racism, at least be fair. You must denounce your own country that was
founded on ultra racism, and you, the recipient of stolen property,
are duty bound to return "your" property to the few surviving Native
Americans. Failing that, you should at least stop ranting against
racism and acknowledge that you, yourself, are a bountiful beneficiary
of the rich rewards of racism. There were no gods or God until human
beings created them. Nature created man, and man created gods. It's
a simple as that. For more info, please see: http://www.glorentz.com |
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| spiznet |
| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 7:12 pm |
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Obviously, according to the mandate of this group discussions on
racism, etc cannot be broached, but as Anne sez, evolution just "is".
So, indeed it is not racist to claim that Neandertals are extinct
(suckas) and it is due to some "fitness" issue, a biological term. Hss
was not "superior", just more "fit". Of course the history of Hss is
not completely natural, at some point we have overstepped nature. But
was it before or after the last Neander??
-spiznet
On Feb 4, 5:25 pm, "avgilb...@clearwire.net" <lagarve...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Quote: About all I can say to this is, this post is kind of confused.
"Nature" doesn't practice "racism". Evolution isn't the same thing.
Evolution just *is*. "Fitness" is a *biological* term referring to
reproductive success, not some "superioirty" that people sometimes
confer on themselves. As for the European variety of colonialism/
racism, this is a relatively(within the last 400-500 years or
so)development, hardly a "natural" one.
Anne Gilbert
P.S., folks, I haven't posted here for a long time, but I'm back now.
On Feb 3, 11:31 pm, "jer453" <lorentzg...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
If you denounce racism, you should at least know what you're talking
about. We as human beings exist BECAUSE of Nature's racism. Nature
produces an infinite diversity of biological forms that struggle for
existence with the most fit becoming the victors in that struggle.
Racism is the key to Evolution. The USA owes its very existence to
Nature's racist principles. When Europeans "discovered" the Americas
the natural struggle for existence ensued. Our ancestors slaughtered
the native Indians to the tune "the only good Indian is a DEAD
Indian" and the "Manifest Destiny" mantra. Having been robbed of all
their lands and beaten into total submission they were confined to
concentration camps called "Reservations". The USA broke every treaty
it ever made with the natives. Taken in toto (including Negro
Slavery), it spelled RACISM at the MAX. If you wish to denounce
racism, at least be fair. You must denounce your own country that was
founded on ultra racism, and you, the recipient of stolen property,
are duty bound to return "your" property to the few surviving Native
Americans. Failing that, you should at least stop ranting against
racism and acknowledge that you, yourself, are a bountiful beneficiary
of the rich rewards of racism. There were no gods or God until human
beings created them. Nature created man, and man created gods. It's
a simple as that. For more info, please see: http://www.glorentz.com |
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| spiznet |
| Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:05 pm |
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On Feb 4, 6:12 pm, "spiznet" <m...@spiznet.com> wrote:
Quote: Obviously, according to the mandate of this group discussions on
racism, etc cannot be broached, but as Anne sez, evolution just "is".
So, indeed it is not racist to claim that Neandertals are extinct
(suckas) and it is due to some "fitness" issue, a biological term. Hss
was not "superior", just more "fit". Of course the history of Hss is
not completely natural, at some point we have overstepped nature. But
was it before or after the last Neander??
-spiznet
On Feb 4, 5:25 pm, "avgilb...@clearwire.net" <lagarve...@gmail.com
wrote:
About all I can say to this is, this post is kind of confused.
"Nature" doesn't practice "racism". Evolution isn't the same thing.
Evolution just *is*. "Fitness" is a *biological* term referring to
reproductive success, not some "superioirty" that people sometimes
confer on themselves. As for the European variety of colonialism/
racism, this is a relatively(within the last 400-500 years or
so)development, hardly a "natural" one.
Anne Gilbert
P.S., folks, I haven't posted here for a long time, but I'm back now.
On Feb 3, 11:31 pm, "jer453" <lorentzg...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
If you denounce racism, you should at least know what you're talking
about. We as human beings exist BECAUSE of Nature's racism. Nature
produces an infinite diversity of biological forms that struggle for
existence with the most fit becoming the victors in that struggle.
Racism is the key to Evolution. The USA owes its very existence to
Nature's racist principles. When Europeans "discovered" the Americas
the natural struggle for existence ensued. Our ancestors slaughtered
the native Indians to the tune "the only good Indian is a DEAD
Indian" and the "Manifest Destiny" mantra. Having been robbed of all
their lands and beaten into total submission they were confined to
concentration camps called "Reservations". The USA broke every treaty
it ever made with the natives. Taken in toto (including Negro
Slavery), it spelled RACISM at the MAX. If you wish to denounce
racism, at least be fair. You must denounce your own country that was
founded on ultra racism, and you, the recipient of stolen property,
are duty bound to return "your" property to the few surviving Native
Americans. Failing that, you should at least stop ranting against
racism and acknowledge that you, yourself, are a bountiful beneficiary
of the rich rewards of racism. There were no gods or God until human
beings created them. Nature created man, and man created gods. It's
a simple as that. For more info, please see: http://www.glorentz.com
Sorry Anne, I just couldn't resist. |
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| Day Brown |
| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:31 pm |
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Racism was not invented by the white man. What Joshua did to the land
of Caanan, we now call genocide.
There aint no free lunch. I've read that Native Americans have scores
of mtDNA lines, but only a few of the Y chromsome.
Anyone who knows anything about the characteristics of the warrior
class knows why. But then, that diminished genetic diversity, and when
Europeans arrived with various pathogens, *that*, and not the
deliberate genocide wiped out Native Americans.
Its been commonly reported that Africans were imported because Native
Americans were so hard to enslave. Which is what you'd expect of a
proud race of warriors. Of course, another effect that led to the
diminishment of Amerind power was too many chiefs and not enough
indians.
To simply note that different hominid gene pools with different ways
of life in different ecosystems evolve different behavior patterns and
different kinds of organization in the mind is not racist. What is
racist, is to rely on the genetic background of an *individual* when
far more effective evaluation tools like personality and talent
profile scores are available, and can be matched with the distribution
of various hormones in the blood that have known effects on
behavior... that are obviously the result of genetic endowment or
challenge.
We would do far better, as I have outlined at http://www.dc-pc.org/eugenix/eugenix.html,
to provide the assessments to young women of their own risks and
challenges, and then be able to offer sperm which compliments rather
than exacerabates innate characteristics. We have the DNA markers for
lots of pathological physical and mental conditions now, and we need
to advise young women to help them avoid heartbreak.
I have also read of Native American women who have specifically sought
out Y Chromosmes from their own lineage so as to preserve it for
posterity, which seems like a reasonable goal.
Of all the racist groups which I know of, all thru history, the most
racist was the... Osage. |
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| avgilbert@clearwire.net |
| Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 5:45 pm |
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Day Brown:
It's clear you don't know much about Native Americans. There are a
number of Native American groups, which had, in the past a number of
different cultural traditions. Some of them involved "warrior"
classes, but not necessarily as we understand the term today. The
Plains tribes are among the best known of these, but Plains Indian
culture as many people understand it today is a relatively recent ---
and brief --- development. The culture of most Plains Indian tribes
was quite different before they began to acquire horses. There were
other tribes, particularly in the Northeast and around the Great Lakes
area, who had "warriors" at times, but for the most part, didn't do
all that much fighting --- at least until Europeans started showing
up. Similar sorts of things happened with Pacific Northwest cultures,
although they were expressed in a different way(they didn't have a
formal "warrior" class, either, although Pacific Northwest societies
tended to be relatively socially stratified). And then there were the
people of the Southwest, like the Hopi. They didn't have a "warrior
class" at all! Europeans certainly bent these cultures *way* out of
shape, but the kind of thing you're talking about below, as far as
Native Americans are concerned, isn't exactly what we're talking
about. Nor does it have a whole lot to do with biological evolution,
despite your mighty efforts to make it seem that it does.
Anne G
Quote: Racism was not invented by the white man. What Joshua did to the land
of Caanan, we now call genocide.
There aint no free lunch. I've read that Native Americans have scores
of mtDNA lines, but only a few of the Y chromsome.
Anyone who knows anything about the characteristics of the warrior
class knows why. But then, that diminished genetic diversity, and when
Europeans arrived with various pathogens, *that*, and not the
deliberate genocide wiped out Native Americans.
Its been commonly reported that Africans were imported because Native
Americans were so hard to enslave. Which is what you'd expect of a
proud race of warriors. Of course, another effect that led to the
diminishment of Amerind power was too many chiefs and not enough
indians.
To simply note that different hominid gene pools with different ways
of life in different ecosystems evolve different behavior patterns and
different kinds of organization in the mind is not racist. What is
racist, is to rely on the genetic background of an *individual* when
far more effective evaluation tools like personality and talent
profile scores are available, and can be matched with the distribution
of various hormones in the blood that have known effects on
behavior... that are obviously the result of genetic endowment or
challenge.
We would do far better, as I have outlined athttp://www.dc-pc.org/eugenix/eugenix.html,
to provide the assessments to young women of their own risks and
challenges, and then be able to offer sperm which compliments rather
than exacerabates innate characteristics. We have the DNA markers for
lots of pathological physical and mental conditions now, and we need
to advise young women to help them avoid heartbreak.
I have also read of Native American women who have specifically sought
out Y Chromosmes from their own lineage so as to preserve it for
posterity, which seems like a reasonable goal.
Of all the racist groups which I know of, all thru history, the most
racist was the... Osage. |
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| Day Brown |
| Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 9:04 pm |
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On Feb 10, 3:45 pm, "avgilb...@clearwire.net" <lagarve...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Quote: Day Brown:
It's clear you don't know much about Native Americans. There are a
number of Native American groups, which had, in the past a number of
different cultural traditions. Some of them involved "warrior"
classes, but not necessarily as we understand the term today.
Just cause what I know you do not like is not proof that I know less.
I made no comment on the number of cultural traditions. The Hopi, in
particular are known for peacefulness.
But I'm also aware of the massive die-off from old world pathogens,
and can see how this widely disrupted traditions making any evaluation
difficult, if not impossible.
Its perhaps instructive to consider how the Black Death imposed a kind
of peace, in which nobody, no matter how instinctively aggressive he
mite be, was willing to join a army. If you recall, it was introduced
to Europe during a siege by the Mongols, who had to give it up and
disperse across the Steppes to stop their own men from dying.
But since I live in the Ozarks, I'm thoroughly familiar with the
violent history associated with the Osage, and know some Cherokee who
will argue vigorously with your attitude of the nobility of some
Native Americans. Most of the local rural population here are half
Cherokee. The Cherokee agrarian traditions complimented the Scot-Irish
who came in with them during the punitive war against the Osage.
The rapid collapse of the Mississippian culture looks just like
similar collapses in Europe brought on by pandemics. The Caddo had
hardly got back into the farming business on the Arkansas river delta
when the predation of the Osage began, and their surviving descendants
have nothing to say for the Osage either, despite all the generations
of relative peace among them since the treaty of 1828. I know nothing
of the character of the Osage now, other than, if a Cherokee neighbor
has call to say the name, he also spits on the ground. |
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| Jois |
| Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2007 11:40 am |
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"avgilbert@clearwire.net" <lagarvelho@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1171143951.959323.189840@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Quote: Day Brown:
It's clear you don't know much about Native Americans.
There is so much that Day Brown doesn't know much about that he/she may be
in a clade by him/her self. Stick around for a while, Anne, Day Brown could
keep you busy for a decade or two.
Jois |
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| Day Brown |
| Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:48 pm |
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On Feb 13, 9:40 am, "Jois" <firstj...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Quote: Day Brown:
It's clear you don't know much about Native Americans.
There is so much that Day Brown doesn't know much about that he/she may be
in a clade by him/her self. Stick around for a while, Anne, Day Brown could
keep you busy for a decade or two.
My website is http://dc-pc.org
I dont think anyone is interested in my opinion of what you have to
say, nor do I see why your opinion should be very useful in my case.
My words are here and posted on my website, and I assume people can
evaluate them for themselves. |
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| spiznet |
| Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2007 7:43 pm |
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Day Brown:
Oh, guys this is a keeper, even more orginizzed than JmMcGing!!
-spiz the random fiction reader. |
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| Jois |
| Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:57 pm |
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"spiznet" <mark@spiznet.com> wrote in message
news:1171410181.517002.32960@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Quote: Day Brown:
My website ishttp://dc-pc.org
Oh, guys this is a keeper, even more orginizzed than JmMcGing!!
-spiz the random fiction reader.
Hey, Spiznet, he/she wrote, "My words are here and posted on my website, and
I assume people can
evaluate them for themselves." if that's true when why would he/she bother
posting here? (BTW what's "ishttp" and does it prevent menstrual cramps?)
Jois |
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