 |
|
| Science Forum Index » Electronics Forum » Si-diodes in Second World War radar & Communication... |
|
Page 1 of 8 Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 Next |
|
| Author |
Message |
| ronwer... |
 Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:51 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
-name/type number of radar/communication equipment
-technical infor on those systems
-info on producers
-pictures of actual diodes, also "in" the circuits
-anecdotal stories about the actual use
-anything else!
The information will be used for an on-going study project related to
practical application of minerals (i.e. quartz) in industry and technology.
So, since this is an aspect of a broader study, other quartz-related info
would
be most appreciated, especially about early use of piezoelectric
quartz crystals in electronic equipment.
If you'd prefer, answering off-list is possible:
neo.dymium at (no spam) yahoo.com
Thanks for ANY help!
Ronald
Norway |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Fields... |
| Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 11:24 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
<neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote:cb94811470]Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
[/quote:cb94811470]
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
[quote:cb94811470]-name/type number of radar/communication equipment
-technical infor on those systems
-info on producers
-pictures of actual diodes, also "in" the circuits
[/quote:cb94811470]
---
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=1N23+pictures
JF |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Fields... |
| Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 11:29 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
<jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
[quote:a687af9004]On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
[/quote:a687af9004]
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| ronwer... |
| Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:23 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
[quote:427bba626b]Probably you could start by finding information about this gear but there
would have to be someone on the team who can understand German:
http://www.100-jahre-radar.de/index.html?/gdr_5_deutschefunkmesstechnikim2wk.html
Many such sites have links to British and American gear but often also in
German. Another option are senior centers. A few of the EEs from those
days are still alive but there won't be much time left.
--
Regards, Joerg
[/quote:427bba626b]
Thanks! I will check this out. German is no problem whatsoever!
Best regards,
Ronald
Norway |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Don Bowey... |
| Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:42 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On 4/12/08 9:31 AM, in article
KqmdnRpvIuJgfp3VnZ2dnUVZ_hGdnZ2d at (no spam) earthlink.com, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell at (no spam) earthlink.net> wrote:
[quote:7181cdb408]
John Fields wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
I still have one, wrapped in the lead foil that was surplused from
some earlier WE microwave relay equipment. From the looks of it, it was
probably made for 'White Alice'.
[/quote:7181cdb408]
In which case it was likely used in the FPS19 radar or/and the Tropo systems
if my memory isn't fractured. But the early Projects were begun in the 50s.
John's post reprogrammed my erroneous thought that the 1N23 is germanium.
It is the 1N21 that is germanium, and likely existed in the 40s. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Larkin... |
| Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 2:32 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
<neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote:a23119c6be]Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
-name/type number of radar/communication equipment
-technical infor on those systems
-info on producers
-pictures of actual diodes, also "in" the circuits
-anecdotal stories about the actual use
-anything else!
The information will be used for an on-going study project related to
practical application of minerals (i.e. quartz) in industry and technology.
So, since this is an aspect of a broader study, other quartz-related info
would
be most appreciated, especially about early use of piezoelectric
quartz crystals in electronic equipment.
If you'd prefer, answering off-list is possible:
neo.dymium at (no spam) yahoo.com
Thanks for ANY help!
Ronald
Norway
[/quote:a23119c6be]
Volume 15 of the MIT RadLab books, "Crystal Rectifiers" 440 pages, is
all about that. History, theory, parts, applications. Appendix D lists
the common mixer types. The history part mentions early mineral-based
rectifiers.
Some interesting sections are one which notes that some diodes have
power gain when used as mixers, and a suggestion that semiconductor
triodes should be possible, and some interesting 100-volt
welded-junction "power" diodes.
Volume 16, "Microwave Mixers" has some more stuff.
These books show up on ebay, or a used-book thing like Alibris.
I think Bliley Corp may have some papers on the history of quartz
crystals. They, along with the point-contact diode, helped to win the
war.
John |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Neodymium... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:54 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Joerg" <notthisjoergsch at (no spam) removethispacbell.net> skrev i melding
news:Ac8Mj.8403$2g1.7646 at (no spam) nlpi068.nbdc.sbc.com...
[quote:831cad748e]ronwer wrote:
Probably you could start by finding information about this gear but
there would have to be someone on the team who can understand German:
http://www.100-jahre-radar.de/index.html?/gdr_5_deutschefunkmesstechnikim2wk.html
Many such sites have links to British and American gear but often also
in German. Another option are senior centers. A few of the EEs from
those days are still alive but there won't be much time left.
--
Regards, Joerg
Thanks! I will check this out. German is no problem whatsoever!
Best regards,
Ronald
Norway
Ah, Norway. Then you might even find some WW-II veterans from the German
side. I've met a few when I was younger. Some had been stationed there and
liked it so much that they later moved to Scandinavia or bought a summer
house there. One friend of mine would have known a lot about these Radars
but unfortunately he passed away. He went on vacation to Norway pretty
much every year.
In contrast to today the guys at the sites were intimately familiar with
the circuitry because they had to repair this stuff on the component
level.
--
Regards, Joerg
[/quote:831cad748e]
Hi Joerg,
Not a bad idea at all! I should try to locate one of those organisations for
WW-II veterans, you never know!
Thanks!
Ronald
Norway |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Neodymium... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 2:41 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Don Bowey" <dbowey at (no spam) comcast.net> skrev i melding
news:C42650B2.B518B%dbowey at (no spam) comcast.net...
[quote:b92ad8c283]On 4/12/08 9:31 AM, in article
KqmdnRpvIuJgfp3VnZ2dnUVZ_hGdnZ2d at (no spam) earthlink.com, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell at (no spam) earthlink.net> wrote:
John Fields wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
I still have one, wrapped in the lead foil that was surplused from
some earlier WE microwave relay equipment. From the looks of it, it was
probably made for 'White Alice'.
In which case it was likely used in the FPS19 radar or/and the Tropo
systems
if my memory isn't fractured. But the early Projects were begun in the
50s.
John's post reprogrammed my erroneous thought that the 1N23 is germanium.
It is the 1N21 that is germanium, and likely existed in the 40s.
[/quote:b92ad8c283]
I googled for 1N23, some say germanium, others silicon...
But you are sure it IS silicon!?
One datasheet I found was in Japanese/Chineze, and the other didn't mention
Si/Ge at all. Max f=9,325 GHz
It's hard surfing effectively with only 56 kbs at a hilltop far from the
civilized world.
At Wikipedia they said germanium:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RMA_tube_designation
I am out on a job, but when I get back in Mai I can check my own sample with
a multimeter, that will give a result.
Ronald
Norway |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Barry Lennox... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 9:13 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
<neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote:9d35a0eb37]Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
-name/type number of radar/communication equipment
-technical infor on those systems
-info on producers
-pictures of actual diodes, also "in" the circuits
-anecdotal stories about the actual use
-anything else!
[/quote:9d35a0eb37]
As mentioned by another, Vol 15 and 16 of the Radlab series has a lot
of what you will be after. But also check out the Vol 17: "Components
handbook" that also has a fair amount on diodes.
Also, look at "A History of Engineering and Science in the Bell
System1925-1975" There are 6 volumes, ranging from 360 to about 1000
pages, and they all cover diodes to some extent.
The RSGB "Technical Topics" scrapbooks (there's now 4) compiled by
G3VA, Pat Hawker, also mentions WW2 equipments and components in many
places. He was initially a VI, then joined Special Comms and SOE
during the war.
I also had an interesting book by Philips back in the 60's on diodes,
long gone now tho!
Barry |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Fields... |
| Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:18 am |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 21:41:52 +0200, "Neodymium" <neo.dymium at (no spam) yahoo.com>
wrote:
[quote:cd54d85293]
"Don Bowey" <dbowey at (no spam) comcast.net> skrev i melding
news:C42650B2.B518B%dbowey at (no spam) comcast.net...
On 4/12/08 9:31 AM, in article
KqmdnRpvIuJgfp3VnZ2dnUVZ_hGdnZ2d at (no spam) earthlink.com, "Michael A. Terrell"
mike.terrell at (no spam) earthlink.net> wrote:
John Fields wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
I still have one, wrapped in the lead foil that was surplused from
some earlier WE microwave relay equipment. From the looks of it, it was
probably made for 'White Alice'.
In which case it was likely used in the FPS19 radar or/and the Tropo
systems
if my memory isn't fractured. But the early Projects were begun in the
50s.
John's post reprogrammed my erroneous thought that the 1N23 is germanium.
It is the 1N21 that is germanium, and likely existed in the 40s.
I googled for 1N23, some say germanium, others silicon...
But you are sure it IS silicon!?
[/quote:cd54d85293]
---
http://www.advancedsemiconductor.com/pdf/diodes/SiliconPointContactMixer.pdf
And, here's a _good_ one:
http://www.computerhistory.org/semiconductor/timeline/1941-semiconductor.html
JF |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| JosephKK... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:26 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:29:18 -0500, John Fields
<jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
[quote:90460ded51]On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF
[/quote:90460ded51]
Not only that it was germanium not silicon. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Don Bowey... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 3:59 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On 4/20/08 11:26 AM, in article am2n04hciv1c0trs9vmfala4pf78ic80nb at (no spam) 4ax.com,
"JosephKK" <quiettechblue at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote:1462fb01fb]On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:29:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF
Not only that it was germanium not silicon.
[/quote:1462fb01fb]
Do you have a solid reference for that? "Credible" references I found said
they were silicon. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Larkin... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 4:39 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 13:59:36 -0700, Don Bowey <dbowey at (no spam) comcast.net>
wrote:
[quote:990516bec8]On 4/20/08 11:26 AM, in article am2n04hciv1c0trs9vmfala4pf78ic80nb at (no spam) 4ax.com,
"JosephKK" <quiettechblue at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:29:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF
Not only that it was germanium not silicon.
Do you have a solid reference for that? "Credible" references I found said
they were silicon.
[/quote:990516bec8]
All my references say that the 1N23 is a silicon point-contact
(Schottky) diode. MicroMetrics still makes them - at insane prices -
and theirs are definitely silicon.
http://www.micrometrics.com/pdfs/PC_SXBandMixer.pdf
Some of the WWII vintage mixer diodes are impressive. Vf was typically
about 250 mV at 1 mA, and junction capacitances were a couple of
tenths of a pF, about as good as any packaged diode you can buy today.
John |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Larkin... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 4:51 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:29:18 -0500, John Fields
<jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
[quote:2ce48dbc1d]On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF
[/quote:2ce48dbc1d]
Early 40's, actually. It was widely used as a radar mixer in WWII.
John |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| John Fields... |
| Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:29 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 14:51:24 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin at (no spam) highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
[quote:0827152381]On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:29:18 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 11:24:19 -0500, John Fields
jfields at (no spam) austininstruments.com> wrote:
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:51:10 +0200, "ronwer"
neo.dymium.removethisfirst at (no spam) dontwantspam.yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi!
I am doing a study into the early use of silicon diodes in radar and
communication equipment during the Second World War.
What I would be interested in is as follows:
-type numbers of the diodes
---
1N23 is a good place to start.
---
Oops... brain fart.
The 1N23 didn't appear until the '50's, I believe.
JF
Early 40's, actually. It was widely used as a radar mixer in WWII.
[/quote:0827152381]
---
Cite?
JF |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
The time now is Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:36 am
|
|