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| frank... |
 Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:16 pm |
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Guest
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On Nov 6, 10:02 pm, Dennis <tsalagi18NOS... at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
[quote]La N wrote:
Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could
be that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of
debriefing too many horror stories. Because if the rumours are
correct (and usually they aren't) and he was making all sorts of
provocative internet postings, then WTF happened to the FBI that they
hadn't busted him before now, as allegedly they were tracking his
actions. Anyway, he's not talking, and before long he'll be lawyered
up and it will be a long time before people know "the truth". A
bigger concern, IMHO, is that already overstressed troops have this
thrown on them.
I agree with you on that one! What's anyone seeing a psychiatrist
in the military going to think now??? It's tough enough for them in the
first place.
People often go into the mental health field due to their own
problems, and their training often doesn't resolve them sufficiently.
(Been there.)
However, I don't think I've ever heard of a therapist going postal
before!
The short and long term effects of this bloody act
will have implications in force morale and capability, not to mention,
political ramifications. Obama has the toughest j*b in the world
right now. As one commentator put it, "[America] is not a nation at
war. It's the troops who are at war." For most Americans these
ongoing trials in Iraq and Afghanistan are an abstract concept. For
those directly involved, including family members and loved ones, it
is getting to be way too much.
Amen! I honestly don't see how those guys can take it.
Even in Big Mistake Two, when everyone in America was behind it, a
lot of people cracked. That's what combat does. I saw an article
somewhere on the net, by some psychiatrist immediately post-WWII, saying
that about 220 days in combat is all even the strongest person can take.
Again, they had everyone in America behind them 100%. Now it's
different, though not like Vietnam.
Dennis
[/quote]
There may be some interesting repercussions over this one.
Rolling Stone has an article on Ft Carson shootings, seems Army had a
report that multiple tours really are messing up the troops,
especially sending those back without adequate help for PTSD. Not
enough shrinks, VA has had that problem for decades. Waiting list
locally is 6 months plus.
Usually shrinks see a shrink. Part is did I do the right thing on this
case, big part is making sure your head is not going off the deep end
dealing with clients. If you don't have enough to take care of the
troops, you're not going to have enough to take care of the shrinks.
Supposedly had a not too great rating at Walter Reed. Why may or may
not ever come out.
Usually something like this happens, shortly somebody else does
something similar. Heard there was a case with Marine getting killed
just after coming back. |
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| La N... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:37 pm |
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Alexander wrote:
[quote]La N wrote:
Ray O'Hara wrote:
"La N" <nilita2004NOSPAM at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:By4Jm.50855$Db2.45189 at (no spam) edtnps83...
deemsbill at (no spam) aol.com wrote:
On Nov 6, 2:55 pm, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
Frogwatch <ohara... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
What jurisdiction would the shooter be tried in?
Court Martial.
Can he not request a Federal Court trial?
If he did this for political motives, what might the charges be?
It doesn't matter why he did it. The charge will almost certainly
be multiple counts of murder with special circumstances.
Yep, you gotta figure 13 counts of 1st Degree and 30+ counts
of Attempted 1st Degree should be enough.
He most certainly is looking at the death penalty. I wonder if he
will think it was all worth it in the end ...
- nilita
I don't think he expected to survive when he started out yeaterday.
If things had gone according to plan, about now he'd be lying in a
hammock being spoonfed by 72 virgins next to a river of wine.
He is a Muslim. That wine has to be made from Honey. Called Meade.
Nasty stuff.
[/quote]
Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could be
that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of debriefing too
many horror stories. Because if the rumours are correct (and usually they
aren't) and he was making all sorts of provocative internet postings, then
WTF happened to the FBI that they hadn't busted him before now, as allegedly
they were tracking his actions. Anyway, he's not talking, and before long
he'll be lawyered up and it will be a long time before people know "the
truth". A bigger concern, IMHO, is that already overstressed troops have
this thrown on them. The short and long term effects of this bloody act
will have implications in force morale and capability, not to mention,
political ramifications. Obama has the toughest j*b in the world right now.
As one commentator put it, "[America] is not a nation at war. It's the
troops who are at war." For most Americans these ongoing trials in Iraq and
Afghanistan are an abstract concept. For those directly involved, including
family members and loved ones, it is getting to be way too much.
- nilita |
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| Alexander... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:01 pm |
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Guest
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La N wrote:
[quote]Alexander wrote:
La N wrote:
Ray O'Hara wrote:
"La N" <nilita2004NOSPAM at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:By4Jm.50855$Db2.45189 at (no spam) edtnps83...
deemsbill at (no spam) aol.com wrote:
On Nov 6, 2:55 pm, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
Frogwatch <ohara... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
What jurisdiction would the shooter be tried in?
Court Martial.
Can he not request a Federal Court trial?
If he did this for political motives, what might the charges be?
It doesn't matter why he did it. The charge will almost certainly
be multiple counts of murder with special circumstances.
Yep, you gotta figure 13 counts of 1st Degree and 30+ counts
of Attempted 1st Degree should be enough.
He most certainly is looking at the death penalty. I wonder if he
will think it was all worth it in the end ...
- nilita
I don't think he expected to survive when he started out yeaterday.
If things had gone according to plan, about now he'd be lying in a
hammock being spoonfed by 72 virgins next to a river of wine.
He is a Muslim. That wine has to be made from Honey. Called Meade.
Nasty stuff.
Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could be
that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of debriefing too
many horror stories. Because if the rumours are correct (and usually they
aren't) and he was making all sorts of provocative internet postings, then
WTF happened to the FBI that they hadn't busted him before now, as allegedly
they were tracking his actions. Anyway, he's not talking, and before long
he'll be lawyered up and it will be a long time before people know "the
truth". A bigger concern, IMHO, is that already overstressed troops have
this thrown on them. The short and long term effects of this bloody act
will have implications in force morale and capability, not to mention,
political ramifications. Obama has the toughest j*b in the world right now.
As one commentator put it, "[America] is not a nation at war. It's the
troops who are at war." For most Americans these ongoing trials in Iraq and
Afghanistan are an abstract concept. For those directly involved, including
family members and loved ones, it is getting to be way too much.
- nilita
[/quote]
Well one thing for sure. He is not going to be deployed to the Middle East.
[quote]
[/quote] |
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| Dennis... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:02 pm |
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Guest
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La N wrote:
[quote]Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could
be that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of
debriefing too many horror stories. Because if the rumours are
correct (and usually they aren't) and he was making all sorts of
provocative internet postings, then WTF happened to the FBI that they
hadn't busted him before now, as allegedly they were tracking his
actions. Anyway, he's not talking, and before long he'll be lawyered
up and it will be a long time before people know "the truth". A
bigger concern, IMHO, is that already overstressed troops have this
thrown on them.
[/quote]
I agree with you on that one! What's anyone seeing a psychiatrist
in the military going to think now??? It's tough enough for them in the
first place.
People often go into the mental health field due to their own
problems, and their training often doesn't resolve them sufficiently.
(Been there.)
However, I don't think I've ever heard of a therapist going postal
before!
[quote]The short and long term effects of this bloody act
will have implications in force morale and capability, not to mention,
political ramifications. Obama has the toughest j*b in the world
right now. As one commentator put it, "[America] is not a nation at
war. It's the troops who are at war." For most Americans these
ongoing trials in Iraq and Afghanistan are an abstract concept. For
those directly involved, including family members and loved ones, it
is getting to be way too much.
[/quote]
Amen! I honestly don't see how those guys can take it.
Even in Big Mistake Two, when everyone in America was behind it, a
lot of people cracked. That's what combat does. I saw an article
somewhere on the net, by some psychiatrist immediately post-WWII, saying
that about 220 days in combat is all even the strongest person can take.
Again, they had everyone in America behind them 100%. Now it's
different, though not like Vietnam.
Dennis |
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| Fred J. McCall... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:25 pm |
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Guest
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Frogwatch <dbohara at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
:On Nov 6, 9:08 pm, Alexander <Alexan... at (no spam) thegreat.org> wrote:
:> William Hamblen wrote:
:> > On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 09:48:50 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
:> > <ohara... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
:>
:> >> What jurisdiction would the shooter be tried in?
:> >> If he did this for political motives, what might the charges be?
:>
:> > Ft Hood is a federal reservation and the shooter was active duty Army,
:> > the shot were active duty Army, mostly, and murder is a crime under
:> > the UCMJ, so I'd guess that the Army would get first crack at him. At
:> > least one of the wounded was a Texas law enforcement officer, so Texas
:> > can get in on the act if it wants to.
:>
:> > Bud
:>
:> Nope. Strictly a Federal matter as it happened on a Federal reserve.
:> I wonder why Texas Police were even on base? Military personal that are
:> wanted by other then Federal authorities are usually delivered to the
:> gate by Military Police. Also nonmilitary personal(Police) are required
:> to check all weapons at the gate. Kudo's to that Female civilian officer
:> that pumped 4 rounds into the killer and stopped further mayhem. I would
:> guess the dead Police officer also got a shot or two in before being
:> shot to death. Nancy Pelosi will more then likely work to ban any
:> weapons on american soil after this.
:
:Considering his prior statements to various people about what he
:thought of non-muslims, could this be considered a "hate crime".
:
Does it really matter? Are you going to execute him more than once,
or what?
--
"Some people get lost in thought because it's such unfamiliar
territory."
--G. Behn |
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| Fred J. McCall... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:36 pm |
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Guest
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"La N" <nilita2004NOSPAM at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
:
:Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could be
:that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of debriefing too
:many horror stories.
:
Yeah, he's just a poor, abused baby and it's the evil war's fault.
You're an idiot, Nilita.
:
:Because if the rumours are correct (and usually they
:aren't) and he was making all sorts of provocative internet postings, then
:WTF happened to the FBI that they hadn't busted him before now, as allegedly
:they were tracking his actions.
:
Uh, busted him FOR WHAT? Perhaps things are different in Canada, but
in the United States there is no law against "provocative postings".
:
:A bigger concern, IMHO, is that already overstressed troops have
:this thrown on them. The short and long term effects of this bloody act
:will have implications in force morale and capability, not to mention,
:political ramifications.
:
Oh, bullshit. One loony doesn't have that kind of impact.
Gods, you're a stupid bint!
--
"Ordinarily he is insane. But he has lucid moments when he is
only stupid."
-- Heinrich Heine |
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| La N... |
| Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:41 pm |
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Guest
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Dennis wrote:
[quote]La N wrote:
Even in Big Mistake Two, when everyone in America was behind it, a
lot of people cracked. That's what combat does. I saw an article
somewhere on the net, by some psychiatrist immediately post-WWII,
saying that about 220 days in combat is all even the strongest person
can take. Again, they had everyone in America behind them 100%. Now
it's different, though not like Vietnam.
[/quote]
With Remembrance Day coming up in Canada November 11th, I've been listening
much of the day to a CBC Radio documentary featuring people narrating
stories/anecdotes/letters/memoirs of people who fought in WWI, WWII, and the
Korean War, as well as recollections of family members who suffered the loss
of their loved ones. Some, of course, survived ... and everything changed
in the family ....
I don't think "we" have seen as many suicides in the Armed Forces as are
being experienced in recent years. It's just awful.
- nilita |
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| Jack Linthicum... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:53 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 6, 9:02 pm, "La N" <nilita2004NOS... at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
[quote]deemsb... at (no spam) aol.com wrote:
On Nov 6, 2:55 pm, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
Frogwatch <ohara... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
What jurisdiction would the shooter be tried in?
Court Martial.
Can he not request a Federal Court trial?
If he did this for political motives, what might the charges be?
It doesn't matter why he did it. The charge will almost certainly be
multiple counts of murder with special circumstances.
Yep, you gotta figure 13 counts of 1st Degree and 30+ counts of
Attempted 1st Degree should be enough.
He most certainly is looking at the death penalty. I wonder if he will
think it was all worth it in the end ...
- nilita
[/quote]
He had problems with women, those 70 virgins should get ready for
some hard times. |
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| Jack Linthicum... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:57 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 7, 3:19 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
[quote]La N wrote:
If things had gone according to plan, about now he'd be lying in a hammock
being spoonfed by 72 virgins next to a river of wine.
Do you seriously believe a psychiatrist who is also a major in the US
army is that unsophisticated?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
[/quote]
He dressed in Muslim attire before going forward and yelled Allah
Akbar before he started shooting. But on the other hand he bought a
very expensive gun and gave away his belongings.
http://www.freedomslighthouse.com/2009/11/security-camera-video-shows-fort-hood.html |
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| Jack Linthicum... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 2:41 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 7, 7:38 am, Jim Yanik <jya... at (no spam) abuse.gov> wrote:
[quote]Alexander <Alexan... at (no spam) thegreat.org> wrote innews:7lk5m4F3de0nqU1 at (no spam) mid.individual.net:
Frogwatch wrote:
On Nov 6, 9:08 pm, Alexander <Alexan... at (no spam) thegreat.org> wrote:
William Hamblen wrote:
On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 09:48:50 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
ohara... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
What jurisdiction would the shooter be tried in?
If he did this for political motives, what might the charges be?
Ft Hood is a federal reservation and the shooter was active duty
Army, the shot were active duty Army, mostly, and murder is a crime
under the UCMJ, so I'd guess that the Army would get first crack at
him. At least one of the wounded was a Texas law enforcement
officer, so Texas can get in on the act if it wants to.
Bud
Nope. Strictly a Federal matter as it happened on a Federal reserve.
I wonder why Texas Police were even on base? Military personal that
are wanted by other then Federal authorities are usually delivered
to the gate by Military Police. Also nonmilitary personal(Police)
are required to check all weapons at the gate. Kudo's to that Female
civilian officer that pumped 4 rounds into the killer and stopped
further mayhem. I would guess the dead Police officer also got a
shot or two in before being shot to death. Nancy Pelosi will more
then likely work to ban any weapons on american soil after this.
Considering his prior statements to various people about what he
thought of non-muslims, could this be considered a "hate crime".
Thats a scary thought. They can only give you the death penalty for
the murders... But a hate crime... Lord have mercy....
Of COURSE it was a hate crime.The entire Islam thing is about hate.
All that stuff about PTSD and harassment is BS,just a lame attempt at
excusing his behavior. Who harasses a MAJOR?
--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com
[/quote]
Everyone who sees him as representing the enemy. Born in Alexandria,
Va he claimed "Palestinian" as his nationality, got ridden (sic) for
being a "camel jockey". Believe it or not officers are just as likely
to get joshed as enlisted, you just were never there to hear it. |
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| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:19 am |
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Guest
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La N wrote:
[quote]If things had gone according to plan, about now he'd be lying in a hammock
being spoonfed by 72 virgins next to a river of wine.
[/quote]
Do you seriously believe a psychiatrist who is also a major in the US
army is that unsophisticated?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
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| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:23 am |
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Guest
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Fred J. McCall wrote:
[quote]"La N" <nilita2004NOSPAM at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
:
:Anyway, it might not even be a fundamentalist Muslim thing. It could be
:that he is a psychiatrist who cracked under the stress of debriefing too
:many horror stories.
:
Yeah, he's just a poor, abused baby and it's the evil war's fault.
[/quote]
Well it's certainly not normal behaviour.
What do you suggest?
That's he's an al Quaida sleeper?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
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| Frogwatch... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 6:27 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 7, 9:48 am, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote]Jim Yanik <jya... at (no spam) abuse.gov> wrote:
:
:All that stuff about PTSD and harassment is BS,just a lame attempt at
:excusing his behavior. Who harasses a MAJOR?
:
Colonels and senior sergeants.
--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
[/quote]
A case of PPTSD (Pre-PTSD) as someone called it. |
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| Frogwatch... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 6:35 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 7, 11:27 am, Frogwatch <dboh... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
[quote]On Nov 7, 9:48 am, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
Jim Yanik <jya... at (no spam) abuse.gov> wrote:
:
:All that stuff about PTSD and harassment is BS,just a lame attempt at
:excusing his behavior. Who harasses a MAJOR?
:
Colonels and senior sergeants.
--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
A case of PPTSD (Pre-PTSD) as someone called it.
[/quote]
LaN: You really opened yourself for an easy shot with that "Obama
having the toughest job" bit but I'll resist except to point out that
it was an irrellevant thing to say. |
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| Jack Linthicum... |
| Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 7:00 am |
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Guest
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On Nov 7, 11:35 am, Frogwatch <dboh... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
[quote]On Nov 7, 11:27 am, Frogwatch <dboh... at (no spam) mindspring.com> wrote:
On Nov 7, 9:48 am, Fred J. McCall <fjmcc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
Jim Yanik <jya... at (no spam) abuse.gov> wrote:
:
:All that stuff about PTSD and harassment is BS,just a lame attempt at
:excusing his behavior. Who harasses a MAJOR?
:
Colonels and senior sergeants.
--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
A case of PPTSD (Pre-PTSD) as someone called it.
LaN: You really opened yourself for an easy shot with that "Obama
having the toughest job" bit but I'll resist except to point out that
it was an irrellevant thing to say.
[/quote]
? WTF? |
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