 |
|
| Science Forum Index » Military - Naval Forum » US drone strikes may break international law: UN... |
|
Page 7 of 10 Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 Next |
|
| Author |
Message |
| Fred J. McCall... |
 Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:49 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:
:Don't you just love the idea that 'The Taliban' is a single unified
:organisation with a single short-term objective.
:
Don't you just love the idea that Wee Willie Black is so eager to
protect them (unless they're working with the ISI)?
--
You are
What you do
When it counts. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:32 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Fred J. McCall wrote:
[quote]William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:Jim Yanik wrote:
:
:> I note that neither the N.African states nor Afghanistan under the Taliban
:> were doing anything to stop the problem pirates/terrorists.
:> Thus,justifiable war.
:
:> at least Pakistan is trying to stop their terrorists.
:
:
:We'll, some of them anyway.
:
:The Al-Queada linked groups attacking India are still sponsored by the
:Pakistani state.
:
Proof? Thought not.
[/quote]
Your government says they are.
http://www.state.gov/s/ct/rls/crt/2000/2441.htm
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:33 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Fred J. McCall wrote:
[quote]William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:
:Don't you just love the idea that 'The Taliban' is a single unified
:organisation with a single short-term objective.
:
Don't you just love the idea that Wee Willie Black is so eager to
protect them (unless they're working with the ISI)?
[/quote]
I think you need to take more water with it Fred.
You throwing accusations about like that will make people think you're
bonkers...
They are, and remain, merely criminals.
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:50 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"William Black" <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hcf9hv$vob$3 at (no spam) news.eternal-september.org...
[quote]Fred J. McCall wrote:
And the only 'training' they got here was flight training. All the
rest of it was done in camps in Afghanistan.
What other training did they need?
ideological indoctrination for instance.[/quote]
how to network and plan. small stuff like that.
you know the ability to actually carry out a plan. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:52 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"William Black" <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hch9ls$vh9$2 at (no spam) news.eternal-september.org...
[quote]Andrew Swallow wrote:
William Black wrote:
Matt Wiser wrote:
On Oct 30, 10:59 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk
wrote:
Fred J. McCall wrote:
And the only 'training' they got here was flight training. All the
rest of it was done in camps in Afghanistan.
What other training did they need?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
The plan was hatched in an AQ camp in Afghanistan by both KSM and
Ayman al-Zwahari. All the planning took place in the camp (see the
9-11 Commission report) The fact that the Taliban gave AQ safe harbor
is reason enough to go after them. Accessories to war crimes at best,
and accomplices at most.
A 'war crime' requires a military structure and a nation state.
The word is 'crime'.
It was a police matter.
Al Qaeda has a military structure.
Rubbish, it's a group of rich individuals who financed terror attacks.
Afghanistan is a nation state.
True.
A government is responsible for its mercenaries as well as it regulars.
If that is the case then the US government is responsible for Blackwater's
excesses and I expect to see warrants issued soon.
[/quote]
if Cheney and Bush go to Europe you probably will see warrants issued. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:54 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Kerryn Offord" <kao16 at (no spam) ext.cantrbury.ac.nz> wrote in message
news:hcfkg5$2m9c$1 at (no spam) adenine.netfront.net...
[quote]Matt Wiser wrote:
On Oct 30, 10:59 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk
wrote:
Fred J. McCall wrote:
And the only 'training' they got here was flight training. All the
rest of it was done in camps in Afghanistan.
What other training did they need?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
The plan was hatched in an AQ camp in Afghanistan by both KSM and
Ayman al-Zwahari. All the planning took place in the camp (see the
9-11 Commission report) The fact that the Taliban gave AQ safe harbor
is reason enough to go after them. Accessories to war crimes at best,
and accomplices at most.
9-11 wasn't a war crime (There was no war...) it was an act of terrorism..
which is a criminal act.
Hmm.. No doubt there were bombings etc in Northern Ireland that were
hatched and planned in USA. While the USA was "protecting" individuals of
interest to the UK...
by giving safe harbour to known terrorists the US was obviously guilty of
complicity to terrorist acts.. if not accessories to "war crimes"..
[/quote]
they were?
known IRA suspects were arrested and held and all planing took place in the
South or in safe houses in the north.
of course the illegal ongoing occupation of Ireland is ignored by you limey
twits. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:02 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Jack Linthicum" <jacklinthicum at (no spam) earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:eeb2dc50-e126-4c62-90bb-0e1e4675131b at (no spam) o10g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
On Oct 31, 11:05 am, John Mianowski <jo... at (no spam) boreal.org> wrote:
[quote]On Oct 31, 9:29 am, Arved Sandstrom <dces... at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
...
Personally I think it was a mistake that Bush did not declare war on the
Taliban; rather it became just another part of this featureless "War on
Terrorism", which is nothing of the sort since no war has been legally
declared. Being evasive and mealymouthed about what you're trying to do,
and labelling people as terrorists, which is also what Bush decided to
do, is precisely why we now have all this confusion. If we'd called it a
war in the first place we wouldn't now be arguing over exactly when
"terrorist" acts become acts of war.
That was exactly my thinking after the initial shock of 9/11 abated.
At a time when the US really needed a good (if not great) president,
GWB was a mediocre one at best. I had never had high hopes for him in
the 1st place, & even I was disappointed.
JM
[/quote]
I keep harping on the fact, belief, whatever, that the Jawbreaker
people could have gotten bin Ladin in December 2001 with a small
amount of effort from Washington. Perhaps not Presidential, maybe only
CIA but they thought they had him and no one blocked his exit from
Tora Bora.
=========================================================================
Bin Laden was too useful as a bugbear to ever actually capture him.
If they caught him the show was over. and thus no no bids for Halliburton
and friends.no invasion of Iraq.
"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our
number one priority and we will not rest until we find him."
- G.W. Bush, 9/13/01
"I want justice...There's an old poster out West, as I recall, that said,
'Wanted: Dead or Alive,'"
- G.W. Bush, 9/17/01, UPI
"I don't know where bin Laden is. I have no idea and really don't care. It's
not that important. It's not our priority."
- G.W. Bush, 3/13/02
"I am truly not that concerned about him."
- G.W. Bush, repsonding to a question about bin Laden's whereabouts,
3/13/02 (The New American, 4/8/02) |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:03 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"William Black" <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hchkre$jrs$2 at (no spam) news.eternal-september.org...
[quote]John Mianowski wrote:
On Oct 31, 9:29 am, Arved Sandstrom <dces... at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
...
Personally I think it was a mistake that Bush did not declare war on the
Taliban; rather it became just another part of this featureless "War on
Terrorism", which is nothing of the sort since no war has been legally
declared. Being evasive and mealymouthed about what you're trying to do,
and labelling people as terrorists, which is also what Bush decided to
do, is precisely why we now have all this confusion. If we'd called it a
war in the first place we wouldn't now be arguing over exactly when
"terrorist" acts become acts of war.
That was exactly my thinking after the initial shock of 9/11 abated.
At a time when the US really needed a good (if not great) president,
GWB was a mediocre one at best. I had never had high hopes for him in
the 1st place, & even I was disappointed.
The problem here is that formal declarations of war are something the UN
was set up to stop.
I believe there are formal procedures the US would have to get through if
they wanted a proper war.
[/quote]
No formal declarations of war has been the norm from Washington's time on
through to today. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:09 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Fred J. McCall" <fjmccall at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote in message
news:mn4le5hsstk69cpiqiasta3nmf4kiv38fo at (no spam) 4ax.com...
[quote]"Matt Wiser" <MattWiser_88 at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
:
:I'll grant you on the wife, but he did help Joe Stalin get the bomb. And
now
:that the Vernona decrypts are public, they prove it. Unlike today, they
did
:it out of ideology. Nowadays, most spies do it for the money.
:
Not really true. There are four main ways to recruit; Money,
Ideology, Compromise, Ego.
Folks doing it for money are just as likely to sell you out as they
are to sell to you. Not good.
Folks doing it out of ideology tend to not get high level access.
Compromise still works. Blackmail of various sorts is a good
motivator.
Ego is the drive for the most dangerous sell-outs. They do it because
for them it's a game and they don't think they can possibly be caught
and/or don't think they get sufficient respect and appreciation from
their own side. Oh, they'll take pay, but that's not their real
motivation.
[/quote]
the Rosenbergs, Klaus Fuchs, Alger Hiss were all ideologically driven
and guilty. Oppenheimer was rather untrustworthy too.
they were naive about Stalin and his methods.
The American Communist Party had many good Americans who were idealists, but
they were dupes to Stalin.
Stalin was never a true commie anyway. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Ray O'Hara... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:11 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
"Fred J. McCall" <fjmccall at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cdoke5ti5guqc2suvud6h74upuf1bk45c0 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
[quote]"Ray O'Hara" <raymond-ohara at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
:
:"Andrew Swallow" <am.swallow at (no spam) btopenworld.com> wrote in message
:news:roCdnYd_C9N2pXfXnZ2dnUVZ8sdi4p2d at (no spam) bt.com...
:> Fred J. McCall wrote:
:>> Matt Wiser <mattwiser_99 at (no spam) yahoo.com> wrote:
:
:>> :
:>> :Agreed. And since this is wartime, we know the punishment for wartime
:>> :espionage, don't we?
:>> :
:
:>> Well, some of us do, but people who act as if it is somehow different
:>> than peacetime espionage leave me wondering whether they do.
:
:> In the USA proving espionage is treason in peace time is difficult.
:
:
:No it's not. getting the death penalty is difficult though.
:
Oh, really? Do you know the legal definition of treason in this
country, Ray?
Hint: There have been a grand total of *EIGHT* treason convictions in
the entire history of the United States. Does that sound like it's
easy to prove ANYTHING is treason?
Hint: NONE of those convictions were for espionage. Five of the
eight convictions stemmed from WWII (four for broadcasting propaganda
and one for torturing Allied POWs) and three were State convictions
(two for the Harper's Ferry Raid and one for the Dorr Rebellion).
[/quote]
it's not usually ussed. even in obvious cases like Jeff Davis and R.E.Lee. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:21 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Ray O'Hara wrote:
[quote]"William Black" <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hch9ls$vh9$2 at (no spam) news.eternal-september.org...
Andrew Swallow wrote:
William Black wrote:
Matt Wiser wrote:
On Oct 30, 10:59 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk
wrote:
Fred J. McCall wrote:
And the only 'training' they got here was flight training. All the
rest of it was done in camps in Afghanistan.
What other training did they need?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
The plan was hatched in an AQ camp in Afghanistan by both KSM and
Ayman al-Zwahari. All the planning took place in the camp (see the
9-11 Commission report) The fact that the Taliban gave AQ safe harbor
is reason enough to go after them. Accessories to war crimes at best,
and accomplices at most.
A 'war crime' requires a military structure and a nation state.
The word is 'crime'.
It was a police matter.
Al Qaeda has a military structure.
Rubbish, it's a group of rich individuals who financed terror attacks.
Afghanistan is a nation state.
True.
A government is responsible for its mercenaries as well as it regulars.
If that is the case then the US government is responsible for Blackwater's
excesses and I expect to see warrants issued soon.
if Cheney and Bush go to Europe you probably will see warrants issued.
[/quote]
I very much doubt that.
The previous head of NATO, one General Craddock, was up to all sorts
of interesting and possibly illegal stuff prior to his posting to
Europe, but no warrants have ever even been requested.
No, it looks like the war-crimes warrants for arrest in the European
courts are reserved for Jews and the odd Chilean dictator who was so
dirty nobody could ignore him...
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| William Black... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:23 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
Ray O'Hara wrote:
[quote]of course the illegal ongoing occupation of Ireland is ignored by you limey
twits.
[/quote]
I think you'll find that the people of Northern Ireland get a vote.
I know you don't like it Ray, but there you go...
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| tankfixer... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:11 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
In article <hcfebj$ekq$1 at (no spam) news.eternal-september.org>,
william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk says...
[quote]
Matt Wiser wrote:
On Oct 30, 10:59 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk
wrote:
Fred J. McCall wrote:
And the only 'training' they got here was flight training. All the
rest of it was done in camps in Afghanistan.
What other training did they need?
--
William Black
"Any number under six"
The answer given by Englishman Richard Peeke when asked by the Duke of
Medina Sidonia how many Spanish sword and buckler men he could beat
single handed with a quarterstaff.
The plan was hatched in an AQ camp in Afghanistan by both KSM and
Ayman al-Zwahari. All the planning took place in the camp (see the
9-11 Commission report) The fact that the Taliban gave AQ safe harbor
is reason enough to go after them. Accessories to war crimes at best,
and accomplices at most.
A 'war crime' requires a military structure and a nation state.
[/quote]
At the time the Taliban was the nation-state of Afghanistan...
[quote]
The word is 'crime'.
It was a police matter.[/quote] |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Fred J. McCall... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:12 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:Fred J. McCall wrote:
:> William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:>
:> :Jim Yanik wrote:
:> :>
:> :> I note that neither the N.African states nor Afghanistan under the Taliban
:> :> were doing anything to stop the problem pirates/terrorists.
:> :> Thus,justifiable war.
:> :>
:> :> at least Pakistan is trying to stop their terrorists.
:> :>
:> :
:> :We'll, some of them anyway.
:> :
:> :The Al-Queada linked groups attacking India are still sponsored by the
:> :Pakistani state.
:> :
:>
:> Proof? Thought not.
:
:Your government says they are.
:
Wrong.
:
:http://www.state.gov/s/ct/rls/crt/2000/2441.htm
:
You said "are still sponsored". Your cite is from almost a decade
ago. And even at that, it still doesn't say what you claimed above.
"Concern about reports ... in Kashmir" is *NOT* the same thing as the
United States government asserting that Pakistani-supported terrorists
are attacking India.
Proof? Thought not.
--
"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the
soul with evil."
-- Socrates |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
| Fred J. McCall... |
| Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:13 pm |
|
|
|
Guest
|
William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:Fred J. McCall wrote:
:> William Black <william.black at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
:>
:> :
:> :Don't you just love the idea that 'The Taliban' is a single unified
:> :organisation with a single short-term objective.
:> :
:>
:> Don't you just love the idea that Wee Willie Black is so eager to
:> protect them (unless they're working with the ISI)?
:>
:
:I think you need to take more water with it Fred.
:
:You throwing accusations about like that will make people think you're
:bonkers...
:
Keep squirming, Willie, but I'm hardly the only one to have noticed
your actions.
:
:They are, and remain, merely criminals.
:
Wrong.
--
"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the
soul with evil."
-- Socrates |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
The time now is Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:48 pm
|
|