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| mpc755... |
 Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:49 am |
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| PD... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:39 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 11:49 am, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:dae825f774]If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
[/quote:dae825f774]
Cute.
Now, keep in mind that the gedanken is an explanatory tool to help
understand what relativity says. It is in no way an experiment. Nor
has there ever been an experiment done involving a train to test
relativity's claims.
However, there HAVE been experiments done that are similar in concept
to the train set-up, at least in terms of the underlying physics.
And what's interesting is that the experimental results are consistent
with relativity and not with the scheme that you've drawn. Already. |
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| paparios at (no spam) gmail.com... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:31 am |
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Guest
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On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:9f8e5c65d8]If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
[/quote:9f8e5c65d8]
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:32 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 3:39 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:c3e578d8c9]On Oct 8, 11:49 am, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
Cute.
Now, keep in mind that the gedanken is an explanatory tool to help
understand what relativity says. It is in no way an experiment. Nor
has there ever been an experiment done involving a train to test
relativity's claims.
However, there HAVE been experiments done that are similar in concept
to the train set-up, at least in terms of the underlying physics.
And what's interesting is that the experimental results are consistent
with relativity and not with the scheme that you've drawn. Already.
[/quote:c3e578d8c9]
Yes, because the tests are performed within a single aether. |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:37 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:23e9691a0d]On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
[/quote:23e9691a0d]
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches B' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity. |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:40 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:515153d930]On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
[/quote:515153d930]
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity. |
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| PD... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:47 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 3:40 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:7648423a8f]On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
[/quote:7648423a8f]
No, that is NOT what Einstein's train gedanken says happens, at all.
Good heavens. It appears you don't know what SR says.
Right on your YouTube video page you'll see a much better video that
DOES say what Einstein's train gedanken says. You'll see it's much
different than what you just wrote above.
[quote:7648423a8f]
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.[/quote:7648423a8f] |
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| paparios at (no spam) gmail.com... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:50 am |
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Guest
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On 8 oct, 16:40, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:3c7bf4a7ce]On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
[/quote:3c7bf4a7ce]
No! you are as always ignorant of even what Einstein gedanken says,
so...
You are showing four (4) events or flashes instead of the two (2)
flashes that Einstein used. And, of course, the relativity of
simultaneity means that those two events while being simultaneous for
one of the observers (M for instance), will most definitely not be
simultaneous for the other observer M', and vice versa.
This was already discussed some months ago, so you are clearly trying
to resurrect a dead cow here.
Miguel Rios |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:55 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 4:47 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:92714edb0d]On Oct 8, 3:40 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames..
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
No, that is NOT what Einstein's train gedanken says happens, at all.
Good heavens. It appears you don't know what SR says.
Right on your YouTube video page you'll see a much better video that
DOES say what Einstein's train gedanken says. You'll see it's much
different than what you just wrote above.
[/quote:92714edb0d]
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. The only point I am
trying to make to the other poster is the light from A' does not reach
M prior to the light from A reaching M in Einstein's train thought
experiment. In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning
strike at A/A' is a single event and ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously.
In Simultaneity of Relativity the light from A' reaches M prior to the
light from A reaching M.
[quote:92714edb0d]
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
[/quote:92714edb0d] |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:57 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 4:50 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:cc983d7c05]On 8 oct, 16:40, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames..
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
No! you are as always ignorant of even what Einstein gedanken says,
so...
You are showing four (4) events or flashes instead of the two (2)
flashes that Einstein used. And, of course, the relativity of
simultaneity means that those two events while being simultaneous for
one of the observers (M for instance), will most definitely not be
simultaneous for the other observer M', and vice versa.
This was already discussed some months ago, so you are clearly trying
to resurrect a dead cow here.
Miguel Rios
[/quote:cc983d7c05]
You do not understand Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning strike at A/A'
is a single event and all of the light from A/A' will reach M
simultaneously.
This is not what is occurring in Simultaneity of Relativity. In
Simultaneity of Relativity, the light from the lightning strike at A'
reaches M prior to the light from A reaching M. |
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| PD... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:05 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 3:32 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:54cb31edc1]On Oct 8, 3:39 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 11:49 am, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
Cute.
Now, keep in mind that the gedanken is an explanatory tool to help
understand what relativity says. It is in no way an experiment. Nor
has there ever been an experiment done involving a train to test
relativity's claims.
However, there HAVE been experiments done that are similar in concept
to the train set-up, at least in terms of the underlying physics.
And what's interesting is that the experimental results are consistent
with relativity and not with the scheme that you've drawn. Already.
Yes, because the tests are performed within a single aether.
[/quote:54cb31edc1]
So is your train picture. And the experimental results are not
consistent with your movie. |
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| paparios at (no spam) gmail.com... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:06 am |
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Guest
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On 8 oct, 16:57, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:8404c1cf81]On Oct 8, 4:50 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 16:40, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
No! you are as always ignorant of even what Einstein gedanken says,
so...
You are showing four (4) events or flashes instead of the two (2)
flashes that Einstein used. And, of course, the relativity of
simultaneity means that those two events while being simultaneous for
one of the observers (M for instance), will most definitely not be
simultaneous for the other observer M', and vice versa.
This was already discussed some months ago, so you are clearly trying
to resurrect a dead cow here.
Miguel Rios
You do not understand Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning strike at A/A'
is a single event and all of the light from A/A' will reach M
simultaneously.
This is not what is occurring in Simultaneity of Relativity. In
Simultaneity of Relativity, the light from the lightning strike at A'
reaches M prior to the light from A reaching M
[/quote:8404c1cf81]
No it is you who, clearly, does not understand any physics.
If you now are asserting that the strikes are simultaneous at points A
and A', then your video is totally bogus since you are clearly showing
two circles growing one from point A and the other from point A' and
hence they are not moving at the same speed.
Miguel Rios |
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| PD... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:09 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 3:55 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:b024b9808f]On Oct 8, 4:47 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 3:40 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
No, that is NOT what Einstein's train gedanken says happens, at all.
Good heavens. It appears you don't know what SR says.
Right on your YouTube video page you'll see a much better video that
DOES say what Einstein's train gedanken says. You'll see it's much
different than what you just wrote above.
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. The only point I am
trying to make to the other poster is the light from A' does not reach
M prior to the light from A reaching M in Einstein's train thought
experiment. In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning
strike at A/A' is a single event and ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously.
[/quote:b024b9808f]
No sir. The lighting strikes at A/A' are two separate events. You have
a mistaken idea of what "event" means in relativity. An event, as
defined for this purpose, is something that happens at a particular
place and a particular time, not just at a particular time. And since
A and A' happen at different places, they are separate events.
Secondly, the gedanken doesn't say that the light doesn't arrive at M
simultaneously. It says that it doesn't arrive at M' simultaneously.
It's apparent that you don't know what the train gedanken description
is. Have you tried to read it?
[quote:b024b9808f]
In Simultaneity of Relativity the light from A' reaches M prior to the
light from A reaching M.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
[/quote:b024b9808f] |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:15 am |
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Guest
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On Oct 8, 5:09 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:a03c259963]On Oct 8, 3:55 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:47 pm, PD <thedraperfam... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 3:40 pm, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
No, that is NOT what Einstein's train gedanken says happens, at all.
Good heavens. It appears you don't know what SR says.
Right on your YouTube video page you'll see a much better video that
DOES say what Einstein's train gedanken says. You'll see it's much
different than what you just wrote above.
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. The only point I am
trying to make to the other poster is the light from A' does not reach
M prior to the light from A reaching M in Einstein's train thought
experiment. In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning
strike at A/A' is a single event and ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously.
No sir. The lighting strikes at A/A' are two separate events. You have
a mistaken idea of what "event" means in relativity. An event, as
defined for this purpose, is something that happens at a particular
place and a particular time, not just at a particular time. And since
A and A' happen at different places, they are separate events.
Secondly, the gedanken doesn't say that the light doesn't arrive at M
simultaneously. It says that it doesn't arrive at M' simultaneously.
It's apparent that you don't know what the train gedanken description
is. Have you tried to read it?
[/quote:a03c259963]
The light from A/A' reaches M simultaneously in Einstein's Train
Thought Experiment. If you do not understand this point in Einstein's
Train Thought Experiment when discussing Relativity of Simultaneity,
you are clueless.
[quote:a03c259963]
In Simultaneity of Relativity the light from A' reaches M prior to the
light from A reaching M.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
[/quote:a03c259963] |
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| mpc755... |
| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:17 am |
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Guest
|
On Oct 8, 5:06 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
[quote:04948d696c]On 8 oct, 16:57, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:50 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 16:40, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On Oct 8, 4:31 pm, "papar... at (no spam) gmail.com" <papar... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 oct, 12:49, mpc755 <mpc... at (no spam) gmail.com> wrote:
If the aether is stationary relative to the embankment and stationary
relative to the train, this is what will occur in Einstein's train
thought experiment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyWTaXMElUk
This is a very good piece of work of yours, that provides a very good
proof of Einstein's relativity of simultaneity.
You describe what happens in both the train and the embankment frames.
a) Considering the events as observed by M' on the train, the light
fronts coming from points A' and B' arrive to the location of M'
simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by M,
the light front coming from point A' gets to the location of M well
BEFORE arriving to the location of M', while the light front coming
from point B' gets to the location of M well AFTER passing through the
location of M'. Very well done!!!
b) Now, you also nicely show the situation as seen from the point of
view of M. Considering the events as observed by M on the embankment,
the light fronts coming from points A and B arrive to the location of
M simultaneously, while clearly it is also seen that, as observed by
M', the light front coming from point A gets to the location of M'
well AFTER arriving to the location of M, while the light front coming
from point B gets to the location of M' well BEFORE passing through
the location of M.
Once again, you have proved beyond any doubt the relativity of
simultaneity according to Einstein gedanken. Congratultions.
Miguel Rios
What I am displaying is not Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity ALL of the light from the
lightning strike at A/A' reaches M simultaneously and ALL of the light
from the lightning strike A/A' reaches M' simultaneously, and ALL of
the light from lightning strike at B/B' reaches M simultaneously, and
ALL of the light from the lightning strike at B/B' reaches M'
simultaneously.
This is NOT what I am showing.
But thanks for agreeing with Simultaneity of Relativity.
No! you are as always ignorant of even what Einstein gedanken says,
so...
You are showing four (4) events or flashes instead of the two (2)
flashes that Einstein used. And, of course, the relativity of
simultaneity means that those two events while being simultaneous for
one of the observers (M for instance), will most definitely not be
simultaneous for the other observer M', and vice versa.
This was already discussed some months ago, so you are clearly trying
to resurrect a dead cow here.
Miguel Rios
You do not understand Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity.
In Einstein's Relativity of Simultaneity the lightning strike at A/A'
is a single event and all of the light from A/A' will reach M
simultaneously.
This is not what is occurring in Simultaneity of Relativity. In
Simultaneity of Relativity, the light from the lightning strike at A'
reaches M prior to the light from A reaching M
No it is you who, clearly, does not understand any physics.
If you now are asserting that the strikes are simultaneous at points A
and A', then your video is totally bogus since you are clearly showing
two circles growing one from point A and the other from point A' and
hence they are not moving at the same speed.
Miguel Rios
[/quote:04948d696c]
Yes, the lightning strike at A/A' occurs simultaneously because it is
a single lightning strike that just happens to hit at A and A'
simultaneously.
The light from the lightning strike at A is moving through the aether
which is stationary relative to the embankment and the light from the
lightning strike at A' is moving through the aether which is
stationary relative to the train. |
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