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Citizen Jimserac
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:14 pm
Guest
On Mar 28, 7:01 pm, PeterB <p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 28, 3:00 pm, Citizen Jimserac <Jimse...@gmail.com> wrote:



On Mar 27, 8:07 pm, PeterB <p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote:

On Mar 27, 7:40 am, CitizenJimserac<Jimse...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Mar 26, 8:56 pm, "Peter Moran" <pmo...@internode.on.net> wrote:

"JOHN" <j...@nospam.com> wrote in message

news:paadnfqRs5LNUXfanZ2dnUVZ8tyqnZ2d@bt.com...

"Peter Moran" <pmo...@internode.on.net> wrote in message
news:13uj6upgiffp871@corp.supernews.com...
"JOHN" <j...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:6tudndNXZc9y43TanZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@bt.com...
http://whale.to/w/orthodox_herbs.html

http://www.users.on.net/~pmoran/cancer/herbal_anticancer_agents.htm

Allopathic waffle.

Herbs are allopathic medicine.

HERBS ARE HOMEOPATHIC MEDICINE,
HERBS ARE CHINESE MEDICINE,
HERBS ARE EUROPEAN TRADITIONAL MEDICINE,
and... most shocking of all...
HERBS ARE ALTERNATIVE MEDICINE!!!

CitizenJimserac

Actually, it depends on how one uses a particular herb as to whether
it was used homeopathically or allopathically. The term "allopathic
medicine" was coined by homeopathy's founder, Samuel Hahnemann. His
system of therapy was based on "like treats like," which explains why
homeopathy uses only small amounts of an active agent. By contrast,
allopaths use a system of treatment whose premise is "opposite treats
opposite." When an herb is used to *counter* a symptom (like taking
Willow Bark instead of aspirin to dull a headache, or taking garlic to
treat a cold), that is an allopathic use of the herb. There is
nothing wrong with either method when using substances that are
natural to the human body. The problem with modern medicine is the
use of UN-natural substances that not only cause dangerous side
effects but cannot actually treat, cure, or heal anything.

Thanks, interesting points. I question if there
is nothing wrong with either method and you
will find an excellent critique of the fundamental
philosophy of allopathic medicine in James Tyler
Kent M.D.'s "Lectures on Homeopathic Philosophy"
(easily found in google book search, copyright expired,
available for free download).

Citizen Jimserac

It may be that Hahnemann believed the allopathic use of herbs was
inherently inferior to a homeopathic approach using the same herbs.
I'm not sure about that. It's interesting that despite the word
"allopath" being created by him, the definition we use today has
drifted to the point that we use it only as a reference to
reductionism, which is an incorrect usage. His term was meant to
describe a simple differentiation based on the principle of homeopathy
as a way to invoke the body's natural defenses in the presence of a
minute challenge, as opposed to the principle of "allopathy" as a way
to combat (or compensate for) something gone wrong. Neither has
anything to do with holism vs. reductionism. Ironically, vaccine is
based on EXACTLY the same principle as homeopathy, although our
resident drug apologists (and others) will frantically deny it,
whereas I don't believe at all in the safety or effectiveness of
vaccine. This illustrates why it doesn't matter what something is
*called* but rather what something DOES, and WHY. In my opinion, we
may *think* we are using an herb allopathically and not
homeopathically, when in reality we are doing BOTH at the same time.
The key is whether or not those substances are natural to the human
body, properly prepared, and beneficially metabolized.

Sorry I ran on. Thanks for the reference to Kent's material, I'll
check it out.

Thanks, this was quite interesting.
I have suspected for some time a correlation
between the methodology of vaccine modus operandi
and the mechanisms of Homeopathy though it is of
course heresy to say so.

Quote:
In my opinion, we
may *think* we are using a herb allopathically and not
homeopathically, when in reality we are doing BOTH at the
same time. The key is whether or not those substances are
natural to the human body, properly prepared, and
beneficially metabolized.

Well said and with intriguing implications. Good research
will confirm and explicate this. It is clear that the import of your
conceptions poses a grave threat to the security and
influence of the vaccinationists.

I here provide the link to Kent's wonderful work:
http://books.google.com/books?id=bSE4AAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=kent+homeopathic+philosophy&lr=&as_brr=0&ei=RHvtR-KrJ5O0yQSg7bSbDw

Thanks again for quite interesting comments.

Citizen Jimserac
Richard Schultz
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:08 am
Guest
In misc.health.alternative PeterB <pkm@mytrashmail.com> wrote:

: Actually, it depends on how one uses a particular herb as to whether
: it was used homeopathically or allopathically. The term "allopathic
: medicine" was coined by homeopathy's founder, Samuel Hahnemann. His
: system of therapy was based on "like treats like," which explains why
: homeopathy uses only small amounts of an active agent.

In the sense that "zero" is a small amount.

: When an herb is used to *counter* a symptom (like taking
: Willow Bark instead of aspirin to dull a headache, or taking garlic to
: treat a cold), that is an allopathic use of the herb. There is
: nothing wrong with either method when using substances that are
: natural to the human body. The problem with modern medicine is the
: use of UN-natural substances that not only cause dangerous side
: effects but cannot actually treat, cure, or heal anything.

Would you care to explain to us how the active ingredient of willow bark
extract is metabolized by the body, and compare it with the way that the
active ingredient of aspirin is metabolized by the body? I didn't think so.

-----
Richard Schultz schultr@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
". . . for while he was not dumber than an ox, he was not any smarter."
-- James Thurber, _My Life and Hard Times_
Guest
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 6:20 pm
On Mar 30, 5:08 pm, schu...@mail.biu.ack.il (Richard Schultz) wrote:
Quote:
In misc.health.alternativePeterB<p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote:

: Actually, it depends on how one uses a particular herb as to whether
: it was used homeopathically or allopathically.  The term "allopathic
: medicine" was coined by homeopathy's founder, Samuel Hahnemann.  His
: system of therapy was based on "like treats like," which explains why
: homeopathy uses only small amounts of an active agent.  

In the sense that "zero" is a small amount.

: When an herb is used to *counter* a symptom (like taking
:WillowBarkinstead of aspirin to dull a headache, or taking garlic to
: treat a cold), that is an allopathic use of the herb.  There is
: nothing wrong with either method when using substances that are
: natural to the human body.  The problem with modern medicine is the
: use of UN-natural substances thatnotonly cause dangerous side
: effectsbutcannot actually treat, cure, or heal anything.

Would you care to explain to us how the active ingredient ofwillowbark
extract is metabolized by the body, and compare it with the way that the
active ingredient of aspirin is metabolized by the body?  I didn't think so.

The distinction between salicin and synthetically derived
acetylsalicylic acid is not simply one of function but the propsensity
for side effects. Just because an herb and the drug derived from it
do the same thing doesn't mean they are equally safe. There may be
evidence that salicin is metabolized more slowly than the active
ingredient in aspirin, according to this article at UMMC.
http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/willow-bark-000281.htm
The One True Zhen Jue
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:07 am
Guest
On Mar 25, 10:52 pm, PeterB <p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 25, 8:42 pm, "Peter Moran" <pmo...@internode.on.net> wrote:

"JOHN" <j...@nospam.com> wrote in message

news:6tudndNXZc9y43TanZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@bt.com...

http://whale.to/w/orthodox_herbs.html

http://www.users.on.net/~pmoran/cancer/herbal_anticancer_agents.htm

PM

Sorry, PM, I don't click on the links of those who astroturf for
industry because I'm afraid of viruses and robots.  You understand.

Yes, we understand that you're deathly afraid of lots of things;
fluoride, microwave ovens, and most of all, the truth.
Guest
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:17 am
On Mar 31, 10:07 am, The One True Zhen Jue <Andrew_King...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 25, 10:52 pm,PeterB<p...@mytrashmail.com> wrote:

On Mar 25, 8:42 pm, "Peter Moran" <pmo...@internode.on.net> wrote:

"JOHN" <j...@nospam.com> wrote in message

news:6tudndNXZc9y43TanZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@bt.com...

http://whale.to/w/orthodox_herbs.html

http://www.users.on.net/~pmoran/cancer/herbal_anticancer_agents.htm

PM

Sorry, PM, I don't click on the links of those who astroturf for
industry because I'm afraid of viruses and robots.  You understand.

Yes, we understand that you're deathly afraid of lots of things;
fluoride, microwave ovens, and most of all, the truth.

Andy, when you have nothing to say, why bother.
 
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