Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:bb47bda4-aa2b-4783-8d95-0173254d06f9@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.

100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water
vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............
Fred,
You're talking out of your ass.
First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so

Hey you Willie, the opportunistic talker out of a nice ass:

Wait a minute, you are saying that water boils only at 100C or 212F?
lol. And you're calling ME a dumbass? I see you elided the table i
gave you from the autoclave. Didn't your momma ever fix dinner in a
pressure cooker? sheex
"Are motor vehicle users seatting at 14.7psi ?"
What does that have to do witn anything we're talkinga bout dog?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_point

Boiling point

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is about the boiling point of liquids. For other uses, see
Boiling point (disambiguation).
The boiling point of a liquid is the temperature at which the vapor pressure
of the liquid equals the environmental pressure surrounding the
liquid.[1][2][3][4] A liquid in a vacuum environment has a lower boiling
point than when the liquid is at atmospheric pressure. And a liquid in a
high pressure environment has a higher boiling point than when the liquid is
at atmospheric pressure.

This is precisely what I said. Obviously your abusive and dismissive
comments are gratuitous - since there is no real basis for them.

Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:bb47bda4-aa2b-4783-8d95-0173254d06f9@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.

100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water
vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............
Fred,
You're talking out of your ass.
First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so

Hey you Willie, the opportunistic talker out of a nice ass:

Wait a minute, you are saying that water boils only at 100C or 212F?
lol. And you're calling ME a dumbass? I see you elided the table i
gave you from the autoclave. Didn't your momma ever fix dinner in a
pressure cooker? sheex
"Are motor vehicle users seatting at 14.7psi ?"
What does that have to do witn anything we're talkinga bout dog?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_point

Boiling point

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is about the boiling point of liquids. For other uses, see
Boiling point (disambiguation).
The boiling point of a liquid is the temperature at which the vapor pressure
of the liquid equals the environmental pressure surrounding the
liquid.[1][2][3][4] A liquid in a vacuum environment has a lower boiling
point than when the liquid is at atmospheric pressure. And a liquid in a
high pressure environment has a higher boiling point than when the liquid is
at atmospheric pressure.

This is precisely what I said. Obviously your abusive and dismissive
comments are gratuitous - since there is no real basis for them.

On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot. As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron. This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts. Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C. Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions. This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures. For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation. They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water. To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam. Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems. It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system. Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.

Willie.Mookie@gmail.com wrote:
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot. As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron. This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts. Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C. Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions. This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures. For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation. They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water. To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam. Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems. It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system. Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.


Talking about ignorance: Iron does not - I repeat not - catalyze steam
at high temperature. The change is a chemical reaction that changes the
iron into iron oxide and the iron oxided does NOT revert to iron. A
catalyst is characterized by for a considerable amount of time being
left unchanged by any chemical reaction it promotes (e.g. the catalytic
converter in an internal combustion vehicle exhaust.) So it would appear
you have joined the ranks of a "dumb fuck" as well as the person you
hectored.
FK

Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:6d8c81c6-acdb-467d-9b5f-4c398c572a09@i3g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...

On Jan 26, 12:29 am, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:



Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:bb47bda4-aa2b-4783-8d95-0173254d06f9@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.

100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water
vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............
Fred,
You're talking out of your ass.
First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so

Hey you Willie, the opportunistic talker out of a nice ass:
Wait a minute, you are saying that water boils only at 100C or 212F?
lol. And you're calling ME a dumbass? I see you elided the table i
gave you from the autoclave. Didn't your momma ever fix dinner in a
pressure cooker? sheex
"Are motor vehicle users seatting at 14.7psi ?"
What does that have to do witn anything we're talkinga bout dog?

Yup.... You are a Big DumbAss, because you never go to the core. Yup 100C = 212F at Sea level is the boiling point, "That's where people normally boil water. People don't boil water 2000-Ft above or below the ground." So for you to bring your PSI table to confuse people is just you're blaming the Aluminardi about the falling of the Doll$$$.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_point

Boiling point

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is about the boiling point of liquids. For other uses, see
Boiling point (disambiguation).
The boiling point of a liquid is the temperature at which the vapor pressure
of the liquid equals the environmental pressure surrounding the
liquid.[1][2][3][4] A liquid in a vacuum environment has a lower boiling
point than when the liquid is at atmospheric pressure. And a liquid in a
high pressure environment has a higher boiling point than when the liquid is
at atmospheric pressure.
This is precisely what I said. Obviously your abusive and dismissive
comments are gratuitous - since there is no real basis for them.

NOP! You didn't say that. You believe people boil water at 2000-FT above or below the ground. You brought the table to complicate thing.

Useless to argue with he Moron, don't you think? By the way, there are many Patented products that don't work! Fuck them, both the inventors and the office that granted them.

iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

Jim Rojas wrote:
Gasoline is 8 times more explosive than Hydrogen.

Not true.

The spark ignition energy of hydrogen is much lower than most other
substances.

0.017 mJ for hydrogen
0.274 mJ for methane

See http://www.tinaja.com/glib/energfun.pdf

On Jan 25, 3:25 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:



"Bob Eld" <nsmontas...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:QZmmj.613$R84.592@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...

vuv...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cfa9222c-59dd-43a8-9a17-be0714061d23@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

Mook has shown the equations in the above posts. Notice that no matter
what,
you wind up with iron oxide that must be reduced back to elemental iron to
complete the cycle.

Therein lies the rub. To get iron from iron oxide, you must reduce the
oxide
with something. Carbon, carbon monoxide, hydrogen or gases containing
hydrogen and carbon like methane are typically used to reduce iron oxide
to
iron.

Obviously you can't use hydrogen because that is the product you are
trying
to make in the first reaction. Therefore you are left with carbon or
hydrocarbons both of which produce CO2 the very thing you were trying to
eliminate going to hydrogen in the first place.

Producing hydrogen by any method that produces CO2 as a byproduct is
problematic and largely negates one main reason for producing hydrogen. If
CO2 is acceptable, as it might be if sequestered or ignored, then you
might
as well use the carbon containing fuel in the first place. Why hydrogen?

In otherwords, there is no such thing as a free lunch.

Today, CO2 is just dumped into the atmosphere. I assume your question
relates to finding ways to make "green hydrogen."

You sounded smarter than Willie Smookie.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

How's that work? He said exactly the same thing I said, without the
equations. Iron can be used to catalyze the production of hydrogen
from water, but as Heinlein always said, TNSTAAFL! Which I agree.

One system I'm very excited about incorporates a miniature version of
my variable load electrolyzer that's sandwidched to the heat exchanger
side of my high intensity solar die. This creates a high temperatures
electrolysis system that uses the 'waste heat' of the high intensity
die to help with electrolysis.

This is a variant of the water filled concentrating lens array, but
the metal foil and wire setup to collect electrons is replaced with a
water supply and hydrogen/oxygen collector - which is basically
achieved using small tubes created by molding sheets of PET with
channels and joining them with ultrasonic bonding..

The exciting part is that with 38% efficient multi-spectral multi-
junction PV, combined with solar heating of the electrolyzer, you get
about 55% of the incident solar radiation turned into hydrogen fuel.

There are difficulties however. The central one is the high cost of
the Ge/GaAs/InPh cell - about $12 per sq in. Another is the high
temperature of operation and the cycling of that high temp component
in the PET substrate.

We're working on solutions to all of these. The central one is to
achieve 5,000x solar intensity - which creates some issues with the
optics.

However none are show stoppers - and in the end, we believe we can get
an integrated system together for about $0.03 per peak watt.

So, here's how the new system stacks up;

new system

55% conversion efficiency to hydrogen
3.8 metric tons per hour per sq km of sunlight
$16.5 million per sq km capital cost
$5.2 million per year/sq km.
31.5% APR

current system

15% conversion efficiency to hydrogen
1.1 metric tons per hour per sq km of sunlight
$12.6 million per sq km capital cost
$1.5 million per year/sq km.
11.9% APR

Both assume hydrogen sales of $800 per metric ton.

The current system uses a silicon based solar panel array connected to
variable load electrolyzers in the field. Detailed specifications
can be obtained by visiting my web site and filling out the contact
information there

http;//www.usoal.com

So, with a $30 million NRE charge, and 25 sq km collector area, total
installation charges of $442.5 million for the new system - and $315
million for the older system (no NRE charges there) - and each produce
$130 million per year and $37.5 million respectively. Valued at 10x
earnings each installation when completed would be $3.15 billion and
$1.30 billion respectively. Assuming a five year cycle for the new
system and a three year installation cycle for the older system, and
discounting the cost of capital at 40% per year, this translates to
$2.75 for each $1.00 risked on the older design and $5.38 for each
$1.00 risked on the newer system. This translates to an ownership
position in each project as 75.5% of the newer design and 66.7% of the
older design - assuming all the project sales occur at one time at the
beginning of the project.

EXAMPLE
25 sq km representative solar hydrogen project with each
technology

New high-temperature electrolyzer

$442.5 million amount risked
$2,380.7 million - value realized

$3,150.0 million - project value realized
5.0 years - term

75.5% ownership position
$5.86 million/point

161,500 metric tons hydrogen per year

Current - silicon based DC driven low temp electrolyzer

$315.0 million amount risked
$866.2 million - value realized

$1,300.0 million - project value realized
3.0 years - term

66.7% ownership position
$4.72 million - value realized

46,750 metric tons hydrogen per year

The world currently uses the following fuels to provide the bulk of
its primary energy for industry;

Crude Oil: 28.3 billion barrels
Coal: 5.5 billion metric tons
Natural Gas 2.2 billion metric tons

and produces about 40 billion tons of carbon dioxide each year at a
cost of about $4,000 billion per year.

The world may replace all this fuel with hydrogen gas, since hydrogen
burns under the same conditions all these other fuels burn.

Hydrogen: 3.34 billion metric tons

made with 30 billion tons of DI water each year and solar energy made
with my system. Sold at $800 per metric ton this has an annual cost
of .$2,672 billion per year

The new system described here represents the following opportunity

New System.

3.8 metric tons per hour per sq km
1700 hours insolation
6,460 metric tons per sq km per year

517,000 sq km solar panels total
$6,514 billion CAPEX

Approximately 21,000 installations each 25 sq km in area would supply
all the world's energy needs with hydrogen.

Willie.Moo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade.  That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter.  DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing?  Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi).  Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot.  As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron.  This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts.  Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C.  Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions.  This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures.  For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation.  They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water.  To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam.  Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems.  It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while  ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system.  Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.

Talking about ignorance: Iron does not - I repeat not - catalyze steam
at high temperature. The change is a chemical reaction that changes the
iron into iron oxide and the iron oxided does NOT revert to iron. A
catalyst is characterized by for a considerable amount of time being
left unchanged by any chemical reaction it promotes (e.g. the catalytic
converter in an internal combustion vehicle exhaust.) So it would appear
you have joined the ranks of a "dumb fuck" as well as the person you
hectored.
FK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Willie.Moo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot. As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron. This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts. Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C. Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions. This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures. For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation. They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water. To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam. Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems. It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system. Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.

Talking about ignorance: Iron does not - I repeat not - catalyze steam
at high temperature. The change is a chemical reaction that changes the
iron into iron oxide and the iron oxided does NOT revert to iron. A
catalyst is characterized by for a considerable amount of time being
left unchanged by any chemical reaction it promotes (e.g. the catalytic
converter in an internal combustion vehicle exhaust.) So it would appear
you have joined the ranks of a "dumb fuck" as well as the person you
hectored.
FK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Jan 27, 8:27 am, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:6d8c81c6-acdb-467d-9b5f-4c398c572a09@i3g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...

On Jan 26, 12:29 am, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:



Willie.Moo...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:bb47bda4-aa2b-4783-8d95-0173254d06f9@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?

sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.

100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water
vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............
Fred,
You're talking out of your ass.
First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so

Hey you Willie, the opportunistic talker out of a nice ass:
Wait a minute, you are saying that water boils only at 100C or 212F?
lol. And you're calling ME a dumbass? I see you elided the table i
gave you from the autoclave. Didn't your momma ever fix dinner in a
pressure cooker? sheex
"Are motor vehicle users seatting at 14.7psi ?"
What does that have to do witn anything we're talkinga bout dog?

Yup.... You are a Big DumbAss, because you never go to the core. Yup 100C = 212F at Sea level is the boiling point, "That's where people normally boil water. People don't boil water 2000-Ft above or below the ground." So for you to bring your PSI table to confuse people is just you're blaming the Aluminardi about the falling of the Doll$$$.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_point

Boiling point

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is about the boiling point of liquids. For other uses, see
Boiling point (disambiguation).
The boiling point of a liquid is the temperature at which the vapor pressure
of the liquid equals the environmental pressure surrounding the
liquid.[1][2][3][4] A liquid in a vacuum environment has a lower boiling
point than when the liquid is at atmospheric pressure. And a liquid in a
high pressure environment has a higher boiling point than when the liquid is
at atmospheric pressure.
This is precisely what I said. Obviously your abusive and dismissive
comments are gratuitous - since there is no real basis for them.

NOP! You didn't say that. You believe people boil water at 2000-FT above or below the ground. You brought the table to complicate thing.

Useless to argue with he Moron, don't you think? By the way, there are many Patented products that don't work! Fuck them, both the inventors and the office that granted them.

Gee Jak, my brother boils his water well above 2000 feet. Comes from
living in McCall, Idaho.

On Jan 26, 7:05 pm, Fred Kasner <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:



Willie.Moo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot. As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron. This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts. Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C. Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions. This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures. For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation. They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water. To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam. Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems. It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system. Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.

Talking about ignorance: Iron does not - I repeat not - catalyze steam
at high temperature. The change is a chemical reaction that changes the
iron into iron oxide and the iron oxided does NOT revert to iron. A
catalyst is characterized by for a considerable amount of time being
left unchanged by any chemical reaction it promotes (e.g. the catalytic
converter in an internal combustion vehicle exhaust.) So it would appear
you have joined the ranks of a "dumb fuck" as well as the person you
hectored.
FK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Jan 26, 7:05 pm, Fred Kasner <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:



Willie.Moo...@gmail.com wrote:
On Jan 25, 10:33 pm, "JakTheHammer" <jakthh...@aol.com> wrote:
"Fred Kasner" <fkas...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message

news:i2umj.3091$nK5.2151@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...

vuv...@gmail.com wrote:
iron nanopowder will catalyze decomposition of H2O to hydrogen and
oxygen at 100 degrees centigrade. That's in the Mercke index. Does
anyone know how efficient that reaction is?
sounds like porphyritic iron to me. And do you know why it has that
name? Becaause it doesn't catalyze the decomposition of water but rather
it reacts with water to produce iron oxide and a rather energetic
reaction.
100 degrees centigrade = 212F, this is boiling point of water, even 150F
your water vapor will destroy your Catalyst converter. DumbFuck Poster, do
you know what you're doing? Many of you acting smart went online selling
the Fucking Scam Hydrogen generator (when in fact it's a simple "water vapor
generator")........heeheee...........Yup.......America got
fucked............ Go check the latest cost of living in your
stores........Ain't that GRAND?..............

Fred,

You're talking out of your ass.

First off, the boiling point of water you cite is at only accurate if
you assume one atmosphere (14.7 psi). Nearly everyone but you knows
that when you increase the pressure and the boiling point rises - so
steam can have be very hot. As I mentioned, 600C steam is required to
catalyze water into hydrogen using iron. This has been done for years
and it cited in many an old chemistry text - Linus Pauling's GENERAL
CHEMISTRY from Dover Press is a very good read for those who really
want to know a thing or two about Chemistry.

Here is a chart for an autoclave relating pressure and temperature

http://www.broadleyjames.com/FAQ-text/102-faq.html

The temperatures are rather modest, but this is only used for
sterilization.

As for your comments about the sensitivity of catalysts to
temperatures approaching 100C - check out the operating temperatures
of catalytic converters in car exhausts. Car exhausts are a lot
hotter than 100C. Obviously catalytic converters work under these
conditions. This obviously proves you are wrong in your idiotic
assertion about catalytic temperatures. For someone who wants to
know, all they've gotta do is pull down a technical reference for the
reaction they want to catalyze and there will be given a range of
temperatures and pressures needed for efficent operation. They're not
all below 100C - which is my point.

Please note that most catalysts operate at temperatures above the
boiling point of water. To use iron to efficiently make hydrogen from
water, you need 600C steam. Its in all the technical literature if
you'd care to look it up.

So,your commentary is dead wrong about the catalysts..

You are obviously wrong about steam temperatures and the sensitivity
of all catalysts to temperatures above 100C.

Now, I move on to your point about 'scam hydrogen generator' and 'dumb
fuck poster'

You seem to be the 'dumb fuck' to use your phrase - since you
obviously can't tell that there is a clear difference between workable
systems - such a hydro-electric powered hydrogen generation - and non
workable systems which get a lot more press than the workable
systems. It seems the media likes to marginalize alternative energy
systems by promoting scams and then debunking them in quick succession
- while ignoring workable systems totally.

Now, while iron is an efficient catalyst for converting water and heat
to hydrogen, its not clear it can be made into an efficient carbon-
free hydrogen generator system. Which was my point in posting - with
the technical details to back up my comments.

Your response indeed portrays you as a 'dumb fuck' - which it too
damned bad.

Talking about ignorance: Iron does not - I repeat not - catalyze steam
at high temperature. The change is a chemical reaction that changes the
iron into iron oxide and the iron oxided does NOT revert to iron. A
catalyst is characterized by for a considerable amount of time being
left unchanged by any chemical reaction it promotes (e.g. the catalytic
converter in an internal combustion vehicle exhaust.) So it would appear
you have joined the ranks of a "dumb fuck" as well as the person you
hectored.
FK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'm not calling anyone names. I'm not hectoring anyone. You guys are
getting all hot and bothered with me for no good reason.

Now, clearly you are playing word games with me. Defining 'catalyst'
a certain way and then calling me names because I used it
improperly.

Obviously I know there's a chemical reaction taking place. I gave you
the mass balance equation for it!!! haha.. So you point cannot stick
logically.

Besides, since we're interested in the hydrogen, and interested in
reusing the iron - we need a secondary reaction to convert the iron
oxide to iron again ...

read more »