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| Sonos |
 Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:19 am |
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| Stephen Nagler |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:39 pm |
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On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:39:38 GMT, Captain America
<Captain@America.org.invalid> wrote (in part):
[quote:6b0b79b050]So from what you're saying, a
doctor in Family Practice can actually perform surgeries at the hospital
without actually having any surgical training? Thanks.
[/quote:6b0b79b050]
...............
That's a different issue, Captain. In order to perform surgery at a
hospital, the physician must "have privileges" in surgery at the
hospital in question.
Requirements vary from hospital to hospital in this regard, but
basically the physician must:
(1) have successfully completed an approved residency *in surgery or
in the surgical subspecialty in question*
(2) be at least eligible to take the board exam in that specialty
(and have taken & passed it within a certain specified time frame
(3) present letters of recommendation from surgeons involved in his
or her residency (if fresh out of training) or from surgeons familiar
with his or her operating skills and surgical judgement if he or she
has been in practice elsewhere
(4) undergo a period of "proctoring" at the hospital whereby surgeons
who already have privileges actually observe him or her "in action."
Hope this helps.
smn
PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here. |
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| Howard McCollister |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 2:06 pm |
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"Stephen Nagler" <nagler@tinn.com> wrote in message
news:4ob150dnnk6qh2qm995ge7dgqrdk7oh8fk@4ax.com...
[quote:e1db131a1b]PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here.
[/quote:e1db131a1b]
I wouldn't say that Andrew's word reigns supreme here. I think it's more
accurate to say that all of the physicians who post here recognize the
pointlessness of arguing with him.
HMc |
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| Stephen Nagler |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:09 pm |
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On 11 Mar 2004 13:06:11 -0600, "Howard McCollister" <olive@oyle.net>
wrote:
[quote:bffded0875]
"Stephen Nagler" <nagler@tinn.com> wrote in message
news:4ob150dnnk6qh2qm995ge7dgqrdk7oh8fk@4ax.com...
PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here.
I wouldn't say that Andrew's word reigns supreme here. I think it's more
accurate to say that all of the physicians who post here recognize the
pointlessness of arguing with him.
HMc
[/quote:bffded0875]
................
It's not a question of "arguing" with Dr. Chung.
It's a question of expressing an opinion that differs with his.
And when that happens HE makes it into an argument. Of course his
response is that everything is a matter of "free will" (it takes two
to have an argument) - but by then the point you were trying to make
in disagreeing with him has disappeared deep into the depths of a
thread.
Howard, that is why docs who happen to find this place tend not to
stay very long - and it is that process that makes Dr. Chung's word
reign supreme here.
Well Dr. Chung has picked the wrong doctor to screw with. He has
picked the wrong doctor to file a false police report against. And he
has picked the wrong doctor to file a frivolous complaint with the
medical board against.
smn |
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| George |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:17 pm |
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[quote:a7f31e3685]
PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here.
[/quote:a7f31e3685]
He filed charges against you etc. because of something you said on
newsgroups? If that's true then you have to be kidding me. 3/4 of
the stsuff on these groups is BS anyways. It's definitely "buyer
beware" on a newsgroup and anyone with half a brain knows to quadruple
check anything you find poseted here if it is important. |
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| Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/P |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:23 pm |
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Howard McCollister wrote:
[quote:478cae1585]"Stephen Nagler" <nagler@tinn.com> wrote in message
news:4ob150dnnk6qh2qm995ge7dgqrdk7oh8fk@4ax.com...
PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here.
I wouldn't say that Andrew's word reigns supreme here. I think it's more
accurate to say that all of the physicians who post here recognize the
pointlessness of arguing with him.
HMc
[/quote:478cae1585]
In a word: wisdom :-)
Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
Andrew
--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/
**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W1F522557
What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?J2DB148A7
Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N69721867 |
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| Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/P |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:27 pm |
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George wrote:
[quote:8bc0fe5667]
PS - I happen to disagree with one of Dr. Chung's answers earlier in
this thread and would be happy to discuss it with you via e-mail. But
I have learned not to publicly discuss an opinion that might vary with
one of his. I did that before - and his response was to file a false
police report against me and to file a frivolous complaint against me
with the Georgia Medical Board. That's what happens when doctors dare
to tread on his turf, which is why his word reigns supreme here.
He filed charges against you etc. because of something you said on
newsgroups? If that's true then you have to be kidding me.
[/quote:8bc0fe5667]
Dr. Stephen Nagler is kidding himself.
[quote:8bc0fe5667]3/4 of
the stsuff on these groups is BS anyways. It's definitely "buyer
beware" on a newsgroup and anyone with half a brain knows to quadruple
check anything you find poseted here if it is important.
[/quote:8bc0fe5667]
The charges that are pending against Dr. Nagler are for "cyberstalking."
Servant to the humblest person in the universe,
Andrew
--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/
**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W1F522557
What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?J2DB148A7
Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N69721867 |
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| Stephen Nagler |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:40 pm |
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On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:27:21 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
<andrew@heartmdphd.com> wrote:
[quote:da7c6e809a]The charges that are pending against Dr. Nagler are for "cyberstalking."
[/quote:da7c6e809a]
..............
"Pending?"
There are no charges "pending."
smn |
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| Stephen Nagler |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:41 pm |
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On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 21:40:38 GMT, Stephen Nagler <nagler@tinn.com>
wrote:
[quote:4599c65e2a]On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:27:21 -0500, "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
andrew@heartmdphd.com> wrote:
The charges that are pending against Dr. Nagler are for "cyberstalking."
.............
"Pending?"
There are no charges "pending."
smn
[/quote:4599c65e2a]
..................
In fact, there were never any "charges" at all!
What the hell are you talking about, Dr. Chung? A specious complaint
you filed with the police? That's not "charges." That's a blatantly
false accusation. "Charges" happen when the police give any
credibility to the complaint. There were no charges.
smn |
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| anon |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 6:30 pm |
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On 2004-03-11 10:34:46 -0500, Captain America
<Captain@America.org.invalid> said:
[quote:b55ee6e2b4]Just noticed that, but it seems most FP and GPs aren't certified from
what I've seen.
[/quote:b55ee6e2b4]
There is no board certification in "general practice" in the United
States. General practice ceased to exist in the late 1960's with the
formation of the American Academy of Family Physicians (AAFP), and the
American Board of Family Practice (ABFP). That's not to say that there
aren't still people out there practicing medicine (usually in urgent
care centers) who haven't completed any residency program or passed any
specialty boards. It's still possible, although emplyment options for
physicians who are not board-certified or residency-trained are limited.
Graduates of accredited residency programs in family practice are
eligible to sit for the family practice board exam, but most states do
not require board certification for licensure. Most (if not all)
physician employers, however, do require board certification as a
condition of employment, and most hospitals require board certification
in order to have hospital privileges.
Board certification in any given specialty (including family practice)
does not guarantee competency. However, it is a good sign that the
physician has met certain standards, and most (if not all) boards have
continuing education requirements and recertification exams to ensure
that doctors are "keeping up." In the case of family practice, we have
to retake the board exams every seven years. See:
http://www.familypractice.com/findadoc/board-certified.htm . |
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| Kurt Ullman |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 6:46 pm |
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In article <2004031118420175249%anon@anoncom>, anon <anon@anon.com> wrote:
[quote:afcda4c9ba]It's possible for a physician who has no training outside of medical
school and a one-year rotating internship to find a job practicing
medicine with no formal residency training or board certification.
Legally maybe. But in real life? If nothing else, would a med mal insurance[/quote:afcda4c9ba]
company come w/in a thousand miles of such a doctor?
--
I'd certainly be far more supportive of Bush's
"Axis of Evil" concept if he'd been honest about it
and added Microsoft to the list.
_Chris J in abt-c |
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| anon |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:03 pm |
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On 2004-03-11 18:46:44 -0500, kurtullman@yahoo.com (Kurt Ullman) said:
[quote:b21aa5d17d]In article <2004031118420175249%anon@anoncom>, anon <anon@anon.com> wrote:
It's possible for a physician who has no training outside of medical
school and a one-year rotating internship to find a job practicing
medicine with no formal residency training or board certification.
Legally maybe. But in real life? If nothing else, would a med mal
insurance company come w/in a thousand miles of such a doctor?
[/quote:b21aa5d17d]
Doctors who are not board-certified usually have difficulty not only
getting affordable malpractice insurance, but also in gaining access to
insured patient panels. But again, there are lots of practicing docs
out there who aren't board-certified. Some (especially the older ones)
are "grandfathered", meaning they were given an exception back when the
rules were changed. Others may simply have had problems passing the
boards or other issues which prevented them from finishing a residency
program or getting boarded. In general, I'd be wary of a doctor who
isn't board-certified in this day and age. There's usually a reason. |
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| anon |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:10 pm |
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On 2004-03-11 09:10:12 -0500, Captain America
<Captain@America.org.invalid> said:
[quote:ddec3f8622]That's my understanding of it too but what if the physician who
specializes in Internal Medicine/Cardiology is not Board Certified at
all? Is this a bad thing in general?
[/quote:ddec3f8622]
In general, I would say yes. There are enough board-certified
cardiologists out there that there's really no reason to go to one who
isn't.
[quote:ddec3f8622]Speaking about residency, don't they still have to do the residency to
be practicing Internal Medicine/Cardiology even if they are not board
certified?
[/quote:ddec3f8622]
Residency training is not required for licensure. If a physician is
going to call themselves a "cardiologist", one would assume that the
physician has been formally trained in cardiology. However, their
training may not have been done at an accreditied institution. The lack
of board certification should raise suspicion. |
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| anon |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:17 pm |
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On 2004-03-11 11:39:38 -0500, Captain America
<Captain@America.org.invalid> said:
[quote:5ce939cb13]I'm just wondering since it seems to be that with the exception of
Family Practice/General Practice, everyone else seems to be "Board
Certified".
[/quote:5ce939cb13]
Family practice is not excepted, as I noted in several posts above. You
should expect your family physican to be a graduate of an accredited
residency in family medicine and board-certified in family practice,
just like any other specialist.
[quote:5ce939cb13]So from what you're saying, a doctor in Family Practice can actually
perform surgeries at the hospital without actually having any surgical
training?
[/quote:5ce939cb13]
In certain rural areas (particulary in the Western U.S.), family
physicians do perform some surgical procedures, commonly emergency
appendectomies, tubal ligation, and Caesarean sections. They are
trained to do so in their residencies, which provide experience and
training in those surgeries. Most family physicians receive training in
vasectomy, laceration repair, fracture reduction and casting, skin
lesion removal, etc., but these are office procedures, and are not
really "surgery." |
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| Howard McCollister |
| Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:43 pm |
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"Kurt Ullman" <kurtullman@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ET64c.15907$%06.7355@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
[quote:a9e975585f]Legally maybe. But in real life? If nothing else, would a med mal
insurance
company come w/in a thousand miles of such a doctor?
[/quote:a9e975585f]
It's a good question, and the answer is going to vary widely based on the
policies of the myriad malpractice insurers out there.
And it goes even farther than that; many HMOs do their own credentialing and
base admission to their network and negotiated fee-for-service plans on the
qualifications of the doctors who apply to that network. It's conceivable
that they would refuse to allow a non-board-certified doctor to be
reimbursed for services to their insureds.
HMc |
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