While in the audience of a native professor of sociology specializing
in Polish issues, I heard her use the word "lustration" customized in a

A prior attempt to post this inquiry has not shown. Please have my
apologies if the gremlins get around to manifesting that intial
posting
after this second attempt.

While in the audience of a native professor of sociology specializing
in Polish issues, I heard her use the word "lustration" customized in
a
way departing from my reaffirmed understanding while discussing the
case of a disgraced prelate whom had just renounced his recent
ascension due to past service as an agent of state intrigue. It would
be interesting to hear how a Pole might define that term generally and
in such particular circumstances, especially without recourse to the
dictionary. Further discussion of the matter introduced the mention, I
believe, of "The Institute of National Memory" which had an air
pregnant with meaning. Though some knowledge of recent historical
developments in Poland render an intuitive apprehension of the phrase
clement, any clarifying remarks would be welcome on that point as
well.

U¿ytkownik "Edward Hennessey" <halozzyzxhalo@yahoo.com> napisa³ w wiadomo¶ci
news:1168496586.757911.117570@p59g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...

While in the audience of a native professor of sociology specializing
in Polish issues, I heard her use the word "lustration" customized in a

The professor commited the venial sin of believing
that any Polish noun ending in -cja has an English
equivalent with the same root ending in -tion.

This is true for operacja=operation, stacja=station and
a couple of others, but not for "lustracja". I think
English-speaking media render it as "vetting".

The lovely noun, unknown to previous generations of Poles,
means checking people's past to see if they collaborated
with the secret services of the Communist state during
the glorious years of planned economy and of much more
precisely planned election results; I mean the charitable
services known as the Beating Heart of the Party.

Strangely, while those who informed the services
(sometimes under powerful coertion including threats
to kill their loved ones) are publicly shamed, members
of the services themselves are enjoying veteran
retirement pensions.

For a certain part of our recent (post-June 1989) history,
anybody running or applying for a high public office was
required to make a statement more or less to the effect
of "I [did|did not] cooperate with the Security Service
or other secret services of the People's Republic
of Poland". This was called the "lustracja statement".

Either version ("I did" or "I did not") was accepted
and neither barred you from the position you sought,
but a false statement carried a banishing from any
public offices. The idea - officially at least -
- was to prevent the remnants of the services,
surviving as powerful and often criminal informal
structures, from using a person's unrevealed dirty
past to blackmail the person and influence his or her
actions.

Needless to say, the whole matter is a subject of hot
political contention.

Hope this helps,
Leszek.

"Edward Hennessey" <halozzyzxhalo@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1168496586.757911.117570@p59g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
A prior attempt to post this inquiry has not shown. Please have my
apologies if the gremlins get around to manifesting that intial
posting
after this second attempt.

While in the audience of a native professor of sociology specializing
in Polish issues, I heard her use the word "lustration" customized in
a
way departing from my reaffirmed understanding while discussing the
case of a disgraced prelate whom had just renounced his recent
ascension due to past service as an agent of state intrigue. It would
be interesting to hear how a Pole might define that term generally and
in such particular circumstances, especially without recourse to the
dictionary. Further discussion of the matter introduced the mention, I
believe, of "The Institute of National Memory" which had an air
pregnant with meaning. Though some knowledge of recent historical
developments in Poland render an intuitive apprehension of the phrase
clement, any clarifying remarks would be welcome on that point as
well.


As a supplement Leszek's excellent reply, you can see here how other
former Communist countries have introduced lustration laws:
http://www.faculty.law.duke.edu/journals/lcp/articles/lcp59dFall1996p181.htm

The term seems to have become English now (varied by "screening"), so
the professor's venial sin may be forgiven.

Stack overflow. Core dumped.

And you foreigners complain about Polish sentences
being complicated...

Plus, please don't expect a quasipentagenarian aprosopagnostic
to know whom you mean by "the ever-vigilant and resplendent
subject mentioned to you in a prior posting". If he, or she, or it is
worth returning to, it's worth being named again.

I won't make unspeakable mention of certain writers of English
habitually producing distended paragraphs seemingly rich with as much
punctuation as words.

Though near seventy and an emphatically doubting agnostic you may be, I

esteem you a linguistic hero hungry for the right word, which is why I
attempt, fallibly, to use them. Obviously, not knowing a word means one
has to look it up and that can be for anyone an exasperating excercise
when repetition of the task shows aspiration lives in an
expanding universe. Whether that addresses some essence of the
experience of education or introduces a happy argument for intellectual
masochism, I leave for the debating team. However, there is always

U¿ytkownik "Edward Hennessey" <halozzyzxhalo@yahoo.com> napisa³ w wiadomo¶ci
news:1168908376.661028.171870@v45g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...

I won't make unspeakable mention of certain writers of English
habitually producing distended paragraphs seemingly rich with as much
punctuation as words.

Edward
IAmAManOfTheMiddleAgefBvtMyMindIsNotForeverClofed
ToInnovationIfItServefALegitimatePurpofe

When punctuation (including spaces) was added to writing,
many of my, now heavily decimated, birth cohort branded it
as a work of dark forces, and an abomination in the eyes
of Heaven.

it introduced into the flow of written language, and judged
it to be worth the extra inches of parchment it consumes.

Truly, my son, be not distrustful of punctuation,
and, with time, thou shalt see thy trust amply rewarded.


Though near seventy and an emphatically doubting agnostic you may be, I

Agnostic? I do hope this is a jocular misinterpretation?

esteem you a linguistic hero hungry for the right word, which is why I
attempt, fallibly, to use them. Obviously, not knowing a word means one
has to look it up and that can be for anyone an exasperating excercise
when repetition of the task shows aspiration lives in an
expanding universe. Whether that addresses some essence of the
experience of education or introduces a happy argument for intellectual
masochism, I leave for the debating team. However, there is always

Perhaps where we most differ is in the amount of time
and effort each of us can devote to this newsgroup.
I treat it as a friendly chat, not a linguistic workout room,
much in need of one as my English indubitably is.

But hopefully, I will yet live to see retirement age in Poland
reduced to less than twice the life expectancy of Galapagos
turtles. Then, I shall be happy to spend long winter evenings
poring over your infathomable prose, and explaining it to my
beloved granddaughters.

There are grammarians in heaven? It always seemed little accident that
grammery is another English word for sorcery.

I saw the hat in the photos recounting your joyous walkabout when you

I don't think so. You would likely have zero trouble dealing with the
same
structured expressions in Polish. It's just that English is another
code.

When you master explaining the unfathomable to delightfully perplexing

young ladies, my atomizer is open for purchase of the mystery oil which
makes this doable. I find

more success humming and hoping they come up with words they think my
droning accompanies.