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| Rev. Richard Skull |
 Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2005 12:22 pm |
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Why! Thats Commie Pinko Thing!
The earth was made for the Rich People to own, and diggers to starve to
death for the rich's entertainment! |
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| Quirk |
| Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2005 1:19 pm |
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Rev. Richard Skull wrote:
[quote:5ec4d96232]Why! Thats Commie Pinko Thing!
The earth was made for the Rich People to own, and diggers to starve to
death for the rich's entertainment!
[/quote:5ec4d96232]
Yeah! That Gerard Winstanley was obviously a no-good tyrant, and
probably a genocidal maniac, just ask nu-monet! |
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| James A. Donald |
| Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2005 6:06 pm |
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--
On 12 Nov 2005 16:16:22 -0800, "Quirk" <quirk@syntac.net> wrote:
[quote:6a3d00e153]In 1649
To St George's Hill
A ragged band they called the Diggers
Came to show the people' s will
They defied the landlords
They defied the laws
They were the dispossessed
Reclaiming what was theirs
[/quote:6a3d00e153]
You are rewriting the diggers as communists.
They were not.
--digsig
James A. Donald
6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
AQ/qrv+/ssg5+F6hIBcB99rRoLMBQY7+en+IqiIv
4RPEeknsm+FeKq+eJtDy6bfBvLYPblt6k24yFFHE+ |
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| Quirk |
| Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2005 6:17 pm |
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James A. Donald wrote:
[quote:e317b0006c]On 12 Nov 2005 16:16:22 -0800, "Quirk" <quirk@syntac.net> wrote:
In 1649
To St George's Hill
A ragged band they called the Diggers
Came to show the people' s will
They defied the landlords
They defied the laws
They were the dispossessed
Reclaiming what was theirs
You are rewriting the diggers as communists.
They were not.
[/quote:e317b0006c]
That song is by Leon Rosselson, the other one that I posted is by
Winstanley himself.
And, AFAIK, they did defy the landlords, the did defy the laws, they
where dispossessed and reclaiming what was theirs: The Commons.
What part do you dispute? |
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| Jim Blair |
| Posted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 1:32 pm |
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"Quirk" <quirk@syntac.net> wrote in message
news:1131840982.279059.318290@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
[quote:53802ed1e9]In 1649
[/quote:53802ed1e9]
.......
[quote:53802ed1e9]We come to work the land in common
And to make the waste land grow
This earth divided
We will make whole
So it can be
A common treasury for all.
.......[/quote:53802ed1e9]
[quote:53802ed1e9]
You poor take courage
You rich take care
The earth was made a common treasury
For everyone to share
All things in common
[/quote:53802ed1e9]
Hi,
Read what Garett Hardin said about that:
http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/4834/common.htm
[quote:53802ed1e9]The God of greed who feeds the rich
While poor men starve
[/quote:53802ed1e9]
That was 1n 1649. Today it is different: the rich can be thin while the
poor suffer from obesity.
Maybe because we abandon the "Commons", so now greeds feeds both rich and
poor?
,,,,,,,
_______________ooo___(_O O_)___ooo_______________
(_)
jim blair (jeblair@wisc.edu) Madison Wisconsin USA.
This message was brought to you using biodegradable
binary bits, and 100% recycled bandwidth. For a good
time call: http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/4834
No animals were harmed in making this post |
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| Grassy Knollington |
| Posted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 3:53 pm |
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| James A. Donald |
| Posted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:35 pm |
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--
James A. Donald:
[quote:89f716127b]You are rewriting the diggers as communists.
They were not.
[/quote:89f716127b]
"Quirk"
[quote:89f716127b]That song is by Leon Rosselson, the other one that I
posted is by Winstanley himself.
[/quote:89f716127b]
The song by Winstanley, the original leader of the
diggers is not communist. He accuses the Cavaliers of
lawlessness and disrespect for property rights, rather
than arguing that law and property rights is an obstacle
to equality and social justice.
--digsig
James A. Donald
6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
u02UQgl+Irg4BSUTORMM7RvPK21vmBI4vFxDU91F
4h+QRjDEw46+PbUDSKsIftcXBWDsSIqfb+W8egSjg |
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| wbarwell |
| Posted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:32 am |
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James A. Donald wrote:
[quote:86bed2d57e]--
James A. Donald:
You are rewriting the diggers as communists.
They were not.
"Quirk"
That song is by Leon Rosselson, the other one that I
posted is by Winstanley himself.
The song by Winstanley, the original leader of the
diggers is not communist. He accuses the Cavaliers of
lawlessness and disrespect for property rights, rather
than arguing that law and property rights is an obstacle
to equality and social justice.
[/quote:86bed2d57e]
Which they were. King Charles never managed to discipline
his troops and they were notorious looters and thieves.
His nephew Prince Rupert, his main calvary commander was
one of the most chronic offenders.
King Charles also was rather cavalier about rights of
anybody but himself. Which was where we get the term
cavalier.
And which is why there was an English Civil war.
--
"If lightning is the anger of the gods, the
gods are concerned mostly with trees."
- Lao Tse
Cheerful Charlie |
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| Quirk |
| Posted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:33 am |
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James A. Donald wrote:
[quote:0adb3ab617]The song by Winstanley, the original leader of the
diggers is not communist. He accuses the Cavaliers of
lawlessness and disrespect for property rights, rather
than arguing that law and property rights is an obstacle
to equality and social justice.
[/quote:0adb3ab617]
Perhaps this will clear up your confusion:
"The power of enclosing land and owning property
was brought into the creation by your ancestors
by the sword; which first did murder their fellow
creatures, men, and after plunder or steal away
their land, and left this land successively to you,
their children. And therefore, though you did not
kill or thieve, yet you hold that cursed thing in
your hand by the power of the sword; and so
you justify the wicked deeds of your fathers,
and that sin of your fathers shall be visited upon
the head of you and your children to the third and
fourth generation, and longer too, till your bloody
and thieving power be rooted out of the land."
-- Gerrard Winstanley,
A Declaration from the Poor Oppressed People of England
"And hereupon, The Earth (which was made to be a
Common Treasury of relief for all, both Beasts and Men)
was hedged in to In-closures by the teachers and rulers,
and the others were made Servants and Slaves: And that
Earth that is within this Creation made a Common
Store-house for all, is bought and sold, and kept in the
hands of a few, whereby the great Creator is mightily
dishonoured, as if he were a respector of persons,
delighting int he comfortable Livelihoods of some,
and rejoycing in the miserable povertie and straits of
others."
-- Gerrard Winstanley,
The True Levellers' Standard Advanced
"First, for the power of lords of manors remains still over
their brethren, requiring fines and heriots; beating them
off the free use of the common land, unless their brethren
will pay them rent; exacting obedience as much as they
did, and more, when the King was in power."
-- Gerrard Winstanley,
The New Law of Freedom |
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| Wm James |
| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:56 pm |
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On 15 Nov 2005 02:33:44 -0800, "Quirk" <quirk@syntac.net> wrote:
[quote:cf1094b666]James A. Donald wrote:
The song by Winstanley, the original leader of the
diggers is not communist. He accuses the Cavaliers of
lawlessness and disrespect for property rights, rather
than arguing that law and property rights is an obstacle
to equality and social justice.
Perhaps this will clear up your confusion:
"The power of enclosing land and owning property
was brought into the creation by your ancestors
by the sword; which first did murder their fellow
creatures, men, and after plunder or steal away
their land, and left this land successively to you,
their children. And therefore, though you did not
kill or thieve, yet you hold that cursed thing in
your hand by the power of the sword; and so
you justify the wicked deeds of your fathers,
and that sin of your fathers shall be visited upon
the head of you and your children to the third and
fourth generation, and longer too, till your bloody
and thieving power be rooted out of the land."
-- Gerrard Winstanley,
A Declaration from the Poor Oppressed People of England
[/quote:cf1094b666]
The silliness of such arguments is apparent to all but the most
braindead socialist. Yes, once upon a time some ancestor stole land
from someone. But to make that claim, you have to assume it was owned
by the victim from which it was taken, an argument which entirely
negates the socialist argument anyway. Also, that a victim as stolen
from centuries ago is not relevant today since both the victim and the
perp are long dead. The perp cannot be punished, nor can the victim be
compensated, so the discussion is nothing more than historical notes.
If I have an acre of land then it may well have been aquired 200 years
or so ago by the forced removal of some family or tribe of natives,
but so what? They may have displaced another before them who
displaced another before them, so what? They are all long dead as are
the people who sold it to the people who sold it to the people who
sold it to me. So what? The only thing relevant is who owns it today,
who might have owned it centuries ago and whatevery might have occured
on it or regarding it back then is of no consequence. If the great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great great great great great great
great great great great great great grandson of Og the caveman comes
forward to claim it was taken from Og by Grog unjustly, that's just
too bad. It has nothing to do with anyone alive today. Sorry Og Jr.,
you didn't pay the taxes on it, you didn't stake a claim of it, you
didn't challange the deed, you didn't record squat at the courthouse,
you have no case and no claim. If it will make you feel better, feel
free to go piss on Grog's grave if you can find it.
William R. James |
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| Quirk |
| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2005 3:01 pm |
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Wm James wrote:
[quote:daeda1bad2]On 15 Nov 2005 02:33:44 -0800, "Quirk" <quirk@syntac.net> wrote:
James A. Donald wrote:
The song by Winstanley, the original leader of the
diggers is not communist. He accuses the Cavaliers of
lawlessness and disrespect for property rights, rather
than arguing that law and property rights is an obstacle
to equality and social justice.
Perhaps this will clear up your confusion:
"The power of enclosing land and owning property
was brought into the creation by your ancestors
by the sword;
The silliness of such arguments is apparent to all but the most
braindead socialist.
[/quote:daeda1bad2]
The point of the quote was to illustrate that your brother James was
wrong, as he usually is, in his statement about Winstanley.
The most braindead anything is still a whole smarter than a shill like
you. |
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| anon |
| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:42 pm |
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"Wm James" <wrjames.remove@spamreaper.org> wrote in message
news:1377o1hcvtn8fc59pi8vukhm0j2q5nol8m@4ax.com...
[quote:01988ef4d6]at best. In the case of property of which deeds have been recorded
for centuries, what happened regarding those alive before those
centuries has no relevance to anyone alive today. If you want to
[/quote:01988ef4d6]
it _is_ relevant today. that is precisely the point.
if it isn't, then why don't the landowners just give away the land? |
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| brique |
| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:01 am |
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anon <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:OoednaQfYalhSB7enZ2dnUVZ_sednZ2d@pghconnect.com...
[quote:fef844b545]
"Wm James" <wrjames.remove@spamreaper.org> wrote in message
news:1377o1hcvtn8fc59pi8vukhm0j2q5nol8m@4ax.com...
at best. In the case of property of which deeds have been recorded
for centuries, what happened regarding those alive before those
centuries has no relevance to anyone alive today. If you want to
it _is_ relevant today. that is precisely the point.
if it isn't, then why don't the landowners just give away the land?
[/quote:fef844b545]
It does sort of undermine Israel's claim on Palestine too. |
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| nenslo |
| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 10:02 pm |
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In 16 hundred and forty nine
Everybody was feeling fine.
In 16 hundred and forty ten
They were feeling fine again.
The End. |
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| Wm James |
| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:30 pm |
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On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:42:34 -0500, "anon" <me@privacy.net> wrote:
[quote:8ca21f4bf0]
"Wm James" <wrjames.remove@spamreaper.org> wrote in message
news:1377o1hcvtn8fc59pi8vukhm0j2q5nol8m@4ax.com...
at best. In the case of property of which deeds have been recorded
for centuries, what happened regarding those alive before those
centuries has no relevance to anyone alive today. If you want to
it _is_ relevant today. that is precisely the point.
if it isn't, then why don't the landowners just give away the land?
[/quote:8ca21f4bf0]
Why don't you give away what you own?
William R. James |
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