It seems the original url link was too long and did not work, sorry
forthat.  Here is a short version that does:

http://tinyurl.com/l764vo

One observation in the story is that india trying to advance in a modern
world is held down by 15th century superstition.  What better example
then astrology.

 Consider this also:
"India has great engineers, but when it comes time for them to marry,
they fall into a bundle of superstitions. It's in our psyche."

But this story is about other forms superstition takes.

http://tinyurl.com/l764vo

One observation in the story is that india trying to advance in a
modern
world is held down by 15th century superstition. =A0What better
example
then astrology.

=A0Consider this also:
"India has great engineers, but when it comes time for them to marry,
they fall into a bundle of superstitions. It's in our psyche."

But this story is about other forms superstition takes.

http://tinyurl.com/l764vo

One observation in the story is that india trying to advance in a
modern
world is held down by 15th century superstition. =A0What better
example
then astrology.

"The world is held down by superstition; what better example thanprayer:-

Farmers and gardeners alike all have to pray for rain periodically.http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/liturgicalyear/prayers/view.cf...
=3D832"

Does it work, or prhaps a better question, does the anticipated result
happen frequently enough anyway?

=A0Consider this also:
"India has great engineers, but when it comes time for them to marry,
they fall into a bundle of superstitions. It's in our psyche."

"My friends father said "the fewer choices one has, the more happy one
is with the choices one makes; astrology is good because it limits the
number of marriage partners available to one and therefore makes people
happier with their spouses." His corollary that people involved in a
love marriage should not consult an astrologer because they have already
made their choice."

Sure arranged marriages the world over share this, the vast majority
without the extra baggage of astrology.  It is the social support
network that make it work not the astrology.

But this story is about other forms superstition takes.

"Would you say thatprayeris another form?"

It can be in some examples.

 Where superstition is so ingrained as in
india any aspect of life can be burdened by it.

"Astrology is part of the whole system"

Silly question. One can test a claim that astrology provides success in
arranged marraige. The test then is to look at all cultures where
arranged marriage occurs and see if there is a worse result in the vast
number of those which do not use astrology. The test says there is no
difference, astrology was irrelvant. Wave hand in air or throw stones
in river, the result is the same.

True, I was making fun of your failure at logic. Sky patterns are
irrelevant to human affairs as asserted in astrology. The chinese have
a system not involving sky patterns in any way, , it is just as
successful as astrology, which means both fail equally. The truth
claims for both can not be shown to be valid.

money to predict election results, none have a bit more money today,
none.

have found patterns to forcast the potential and pattern of when such
things happen. This is based on the truth claims on which such medical
understanding is based being supported again and again. They can
predict them with a given range of potential, not however the exact
details of what when and where only broadly.

"Astrology is part of the whole system"

In india yes, but an irrelevant part when looking at the whole of all
cultures.

What a silly distinction without a difference. Then it must be human
affairs that cause the sky patterns then? Whatever the connection is
and however expressed it can not be shown to be associated except in a
random manner with human affairs and any predictive power is missing.

Then explain why all the effort for something whose basic truth claims
are not supported? One might as well wave one's hand in the air or
toss
stones into a river or any other useless thing; which would have the
same result as astrology.

Oh dear, I think clever astrologers use it all the time and whatever
small power they seem to have comes from reading human nature and not
any thing to do with the use of charts etc. as they practice it. What
psychology does show is why people think it works.

Where were all the "astonishing" predictions of the tsunami? Why is
it
not astonishing that there was total silence from astrology for it?

"Would you say thatprayeris another form?"

It can be in some examples.

"In what examples are astrology (consulting astrological diviners) and
prayer (imploring invisible beings) not superstitions?"

In the first case truth claims about the way sky patterns in the
physical universe are said to affect human events is evoked.  This falls
within the purview of the process of science to confirm or not.  To date
it fails to be confirmed.  

The second involves the divine, for those who accept same, which can not
by process of science be confirmed.  I have heard it said that divine
always responds to requests, sometimes it is "yes" and sometimes "no"
and sometimes "not now".  Free will of divine is not bound by any
principles that can by science be tested.

What is accepted on faith can not be confirmed or not confirmed in
science such as can astrology with its physical universe truth claims.

Superstition relates to claims about irrational and illogical claims
about physical universe.  Science is the test of same.  Claims of divine
can not be so tested by science and to that extent does not fall within
category of superstition.

On Aug 8, 5:41 pm, hari.ku... at (no spam) indero.com wrote:

"Astrology is part of the whole system"
Silly question.  One can test a claim that astrology provides success in
arranged marraige.  The test then is to look at all cultures where
arranged marriage occurs and see if there is a worse result in the vast
number of those which do not use astrology.  The test says there is no
difference, astrology was irrelvant.  Wave hand in air or throw stones
in river, the result is the same.

Praying to Jesus is also irrelevant? Astrology reinforces the belief
that gods are in favour

There is an american who has $1000000 for anyone who can demonstrate
with a formal test the truth claims of things like astrology.

"Astrology is part of the whole system"

Silly question. One can test a claim that astrology provides success
in
arranged marraige. The test then is to look at all cultures where
arranged marriage occurs and see if there is a worse result in the
vast
number of those which do not use astrology. The test says there is no
difference, astrology was irrelvant. Wave hand in air or throw stones
in river, the result is the same.

True, I was making fun of your failure at logic. Sky patterns are
irrelevant to human affairs as asserted in astrology. The chinese
have
a system not involving sky patterns in any way, , it is just as
successful as astrology, which means both fail equally. The truth
claims for both can not be shown to be valid.

Several indian astrologers tried to win prize

money to predict election results, none have a bit more money today,
none.

have found patterns to forcast the potential and pattern of when such
things happen. This is based on the truth claims on which such
medical
understanding is based being supported again and again. They can
predict them with a given range of potential, not however the exact
details of what when and where only broadly.

"Would you say thatprayeris another form?"

It can be in some examples.

"Astrology is part of the whole system"

Jesus is not relevant to this, astrologers want to pull in gods as
though they could ever have even a tiny thing to do with them.  They do
this to make it seem they have something valid to say.  Are the gods to
be put on test too when astrology fails again and again under formal
test?

"Astrology is part of the whole system"

Jesus is not relevant to this, astrologers want to pull in gods as
though they could ever have even a tiny thing to do with them. =A0They
do
this to make it seem they have something valid to say. =A0Are the gods
to
be put on test too when astrology fails again and again under formal
test?

Are you claiming this power to be able usingsome claimed power in
=A0a superstition to affect the physical universe?

ranjit_math... at (no spam) yahoo.com wrote:
On Aug 8, 8:35 pm, hari.ku... at (no spam) indero.com wrote:
"Would you say thatprayeris another form?"
It can be in some examples.
"In what examples are astrology (consulting astrological diviners) and
prayer (imploring invisible beings) not superstitions?"

In the first case truth claims about the way sky patterns in the
physical universe are said to affect human events is evoked.  This falls
within the purview of the process of science to confirm or not.  To date
it fails to be confirmed.  

The second involves the divine, for those who accept same, which can not
by process of science be confirmed.  I have heard it said that divine
always responds to requests, sometimes it is "yes" and sometimes "no"
and sometimes "not now".  Free will of divine is not bound by any
principles that can by science be tested.

What is accepted on faith can not be confirmed or not confirmed in
science such as can astrology with its physical universe truth claims.

Superstition relates to claims about irrational and illogical claims
about physical universe.  Science is the test of same.  Claims of divine
can not be so tested by science and to that extent does not fall within
category of superstition.

I said "prayer", not "divine". That is, do any deities that might
exist pay any attention to people's prayers?

Does anyone claim that prayer is a science? Astrology claims to be a
science.