"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

There is no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents, but
religion itself is universal.

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

"Christopher A. Lee" <ca... at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in messagenews:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...





On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbo... at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"Christopher A. Lee" <ca... at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbo... at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"bob young" <alaspect... at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...

SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no.  once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.

Speculative at best.  All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.

Your theory is speculative at best.  Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.

Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

                                                                 There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?

Your theory that religion is learned from parents.  The form of religion is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists  in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.

You learned your religious atheism from your parents?  No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly - your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief. Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

There is no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents, but
religion itself is universal.

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.


Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.


Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?


Your theory that religion is learned from parents. The form of religion is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.


You learned your religious atheism from your parents? No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly - your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best.

beliefs.

source. Campbell suggested that people worshipped a representative of their
primary food source as a means to appease their guilt over having to kill to
eat.

East, El the Bull in the same area, in my area, indigenous people built
mounds in the shape of turtles next to the river, and so forth. Later the
gods became more sophisticated and mythologies grew, but it appears that
simple religious belief came with self-awareness, especially awareness of
death.

Eventually religions developed with moral codes that enabled people to
subborn self in support of the group. Thus the king of a city state and
later nations could use the gods as a means of inciting people to common
defense or offense, etc.

virtue of a "divine right." Religion pretty much served the function now
served by legal codes (which in itself is a religion to some who serve the
Law over arriving at the truth).

At first, it was not so difficult for one city to have one set of gods and
another to have different gods, but eventually some decided that theirs was
the only god. Then it became necessary to convince others of the "truth" of
their god, at first by conquest and eventually by persuasion - and this is
where we are today. And you think it just as necessary to convert others to
your Atheist "truth" as any Christian or Muslim thinks it necessary to
convert people to their "truth."

Atheism serves the same function for you as Christianity does for a
fundamentalist Christian or Islam does for a fundamentalist Muslim, it gives
you a sense of "I'm smarter (better, chosen, elected, etc.) than you
ignorant people who believe different than me."

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

Later 'evil and sin' were hijacked by the priesthood to
embellish and grow their own particular pack.

Liberal religion still seeks to serve the common good but, as you say,
fundamentalism has made the world a dangerous place and your anti-theism
is
just more of the same.

Give examples please.

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B0DC8E.CDB94C26 at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. Your view on life isn't anything I haven't already
considered
and dismissed ... but, yes, I constantly question my own views. Only
fundamentalists don't, whether fundamentalist Christian,
fundamentalist
antitheist, fundamentalist Muslim, Buddhist, Animist, etc., ad
infinitum.

But, what makes you so certain of your pov that you proselytize in
religious
groups?

Psychology interests me, since it may well be our undoing -
a global war between Islam and Christianity using nuclear
weapons that could well wipe out third of humanity leaving
the rest suffering from radiation sickness. I think this is
a good enough reason to be here.

I subscribe to the following basic assumptions about homo
sapien: (1) That the human mammal inherited a freak brain
due to one of the many quirks of nature [evolution]. (2)
He, like all living things, is driven primarily by the need
for 'gratification'. (3) That man's freak brain can, inter
alia, invent gods and then believe in them for a lifetime.
[gratification].

Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit.

Man creates gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content.




--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48AE3C0D.C8B3372C at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48ACE879.E02DD5AA at (no spam) netvigator.com...



Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit., antitheist
troll

Seems that my view on life has you questioning yours?

And so it should

"If you think your belief is based upon reason, you will
support
it by argument rather than by persecution... But if your
belief is
based upon faith, you will realize that argument is useless,
and
will therefore resort to force."--Bertrand Russell

Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist, Brit.

Man creates gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content.







--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief. Even
atheists have been exposed to religion. There is no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents, but
religion itself is universal.

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.


Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?


Your theory that religion is learned from parents. The form of religion is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.


You learned your religious atheism from your parents? No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly - your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.


Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.


Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?


Your theory that religion is learned from parents. The form of religion is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.


You learned your religious atheism from your parents? No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly -

your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

On Aug 20, 8:55 am, Donna Kupp <dk... at (no spam) charter.net> wrote:





             WHAT IS SAVING FAITH ?

Many churches are teaching that a person may continue
in sin and still have eternal life.   This seductive lie of the
"Carnal Christian" is based on two new ideas that have
been allowed to creep into church doctrine.  The
first "idea" is "Saved by Grace"

"For by grace you have been saved THROUGH FAITH"
Ephesians 2:8 NAS

We are not saved by grace, we are saved THROUGH
FAITH.  God grants us the gift of faith and through faith we
are able to be saved.

We are allowed to escape from the death sentence we have
earned by sin, only by the grace (an unmerited favor) of a
merciful God.  We deserve eternal death, yet God has
graciously granted us a way of salvation, THROUGH
FAITH.  The Apostle Paul said:

   "Do we then overthrow the law by this faith?
    By NO means!  On the contrary, we uphold the law."
                Romans 3:31 RSV

Clearly, "faith" does not excuse us from obedience to
the law of God; rather, through a true saving faith we are
empowered by the Holy Spirit to obey God's Ten
Commandments.

WHAT IS FAITH?

In the Greek (from which the New Testament is translated)
the words rendered as "believe" and "faith" are closely
related. The word for "believe" (Pisteuo) is the verb form of
the word used for faith (Pistis).
       Thus:  TO BELIEVE means TO HAVE FAITH.

This brings us to the second "idea" that the church system
has adopted in order to please itching ears and teach the
mystery of LAWLESSNESS:   "If a person 'believes', he has
eternal life."

     "He who believes in the Son has eternal life;
      BUT HE WHO DOES NOT OBEY THE SON
           SHALL NOT SEE LIFE,
       but the wrath of God abides on him."  John 3:36 (NAS)

That statement from John's Gospel declares that only those
who obey truly believe. (i.e. only those who obey "have faith".)

THE PROOF

IF -       The one who believes in the Son has eternal life:

AND the one who does not obey the Son
shall not see life:

THEN The one who does not obey the Son,
does not believe in the Son.

(For it is clear that the one who shall not see life, does not
have eternal life.)

Therefore, only those those who obey the Son are true
believers with a faith that saves.  We may be disobedient or
we may be a believer, but not both.  If we do not obey the
Son, we shall not see life.  The Son said:

"If you would enter life, keep the commandments."
                       Matthew 19:16 RSV

If you do not obey God and set your will to keep all His
Commandments (including the Sabbath), you have
not yet made Jesus "Lord", you shall not see life, and the
wrath of God remains on YOU.

Donna Kupp

    "And the dragon was wroth with the woman,
      and went to make war with the remnant of her seed,
             WHICH KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD,
      AND HAVE THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST."
                             Rev 12:17 (KJV)

The Seven Deadly Deceptions Of Counterfeit Christianity
   www.freetruth.info
******************************************************************************

are you saying that if you sin you go to hell? than we're all in for a
hell of a surprise my friends...-

On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 22:10:15 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...

SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.

Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.

Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.

Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove your
point.

What "theory", moron?

Your theory that religion is learned from parents. The form of religion is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.

You learned your religious atheism from your parents? No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly -

Oh? How so? This may come as a surprise to you, but your opinion
doesn't carry a hell of a lot of weight here. We don't go out of our
way to feel embarrassed just because you think we should.

your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

Grown-ups don't have imaginary friends, Skippy.

On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 00:44:05 -0400, John Baker <nunya at (no spam) bizniz.net
wrote:

On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 22:10:15 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:


"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:ggr3b4p0de842dl4k2pkiud7952mgo8rm6 at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:09:27 -0500, "SongBookz" <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee at (no spam) optonline.net> wrote in message
news:pp73b419ml8lecbc7vi7elu159icn994aj at (no spam) 4ax.com...
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 11:36:41 -0500, "SongBookz"
songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com
wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...

SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion
served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self
and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.

Speculative at best. All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

Only because they are passed down from parent to child.

Children who aren't taught from their earlist years don't grown up
with it.

Your theory is speculative at best. Even the most remote groups of
people
in the most unreachable places have some sort of religious belief.

Then explain those atheists whose parents never mentioned gods or
religion, who never became theist.

Even
atheists have been exposed to religion.

Some were. Others didn't encounter it until they were old enough to
think for themselves.

There
is
no control set of people
who have never been exposed to religion that could be used to prove
your
point.

What "theory", moron?

Your theory that religion is learned from parents. The form of religion
is
learned, the religious impulse is universal.

I'm describing several atheists in this very newsgroup including
myself. And most atheists in Western Europe.

You learned your religious atheism from your parents? No matter, the way
you express your atheism is a religious expression.

Now...I do agree that the form of the religion is taught by the
parents,
but
religion itself is universal.

No, liar.

It is not.

What part of NOT IF IT ISN'T TAUGHT BY PARENTS are you still
pretending you are too stupid to understand?

Please try to think before embarrassiung yourself again.

Likewise.

How have I embarrassed myself, imbecile?

Constantly -

Oh? How so? This may come as a surprise to you, but your opinion
doesn't carry a hell of a lot of weight here. We don't go out of our
way to feel embarrassed just because you think we should.

All because this psychopathic imbecile is in denial about people
refuting him by offering themselves as counter-examples.

"Psychopathic imbecile"--try something more creative.

Like far too many nasty believers he insists we're not telling the
truth about ourselves because it doesn't fit his ignorant and limited
understanding of the real world.

your mother needs to wash your mouth out with some soap and
then you need to come back when you can discuss things like a grown-up.

Grown-ups don't have imaginary friends, Skippy.

SongBookz wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion served
an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self and
form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best.

I prefer 'logical' top 'speculative'

All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

In that case that should be enough for you to question the
sense in such an activities


The most primitive being the worship of the society's
primary food
source. Campbell suggested that people worshipped a representative of
their
primary food source as a means to appease their guilt over having to kill
to
eat.


Could be, or maybe they were worried there would not be
enough to eat later on

Thus, we have a bear god in Japan, the "Lamb of God" in the Middle
East, El the Bull in the same area, in my area, indigenous people built
mounds in the shape of turtles next to the river, and so forth. Later
the
gods became more sophisticated and mythologies grew, but it appears that
simple religious belief came with self-awareness, especially awareness of
death.

Eventually religions developed with moral codes that enabled people to
subborn self in support of the group. Thus the king of a city state and
later nations could use the gods as a means of inciting people to common
defense or offense, etc.

True

Even as late as the Middle Ages, kings ruled by
virtue of a "divine right." Religion pretty much served the function now
served by legal codes (which in itself is a religion to some who serve
the
Law over arriving at the truth).

At first, it was not so difficult for one city to have one set of gods
and
another to have different gods, but eventually some decided that theirs
was
the only god. Then it became necessary to convince others of the "truth"
of
their god, at first by conquest and eventually by persuasion - and this
is
where we are today. And you think it just as necessary to convert others
to
your Atheist "truth" as any Christian or Muslim thinks it necessary to
convert people to their "truth."

Atheism serves the same function for you as Christianity does for a
fundamentalist Christian or Islam does for a fundamentalist Muslim, it
gives
you a sense of "I'm smarter (better, chosen, elected, etc.) than you
ignorant people who believe different than me."

Absolute tommy rot. how can that figure?

Atheists have no agenda, no priests no claims other than the
rejection of all religions as being primitive nonsense.

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B230A0.575C94DA at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion
served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self
and form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best.

I prefer 'logical' top 'speculative'

All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

In that case that should be enough for you to question the
sense in such an activities


The most primitive being the worship of the society's
primary food
source. Campbell suggested that people worshipped a representative
of their
primary food source as a means to appease their guilt over having
to kill to
eat.


Could be, or maybe they were worried there would not be
enough to eat later on

Thus, we have a bear god in Japan, the "Lamb of God" in the Middle
East, El the Bull in the same area, in my area, indigenous people
built mounds in the shape of turtles next to the river, and so
forth. Later the
gods became more sophisticated and mythologies grew, but it appears
that simple religious belief came with self-awareness, especially
awareness of death.

Eventually religions developed with moral codes that enabled people
to subborn self in support of the group. Thus the king of a city
state and later nations could use the gods as a means of inciting
people to common defense or offense, etc.

True

Even as late as the Middle Ages, kings ruled by
virtue of a "divine right." Religion pretty much served the
function now served by legal codes (which in itself is a religion
to some who serve the
Law over arriving at the truth).

At first, it was not so difficult for one city to have one set of
gods and
another to have different gods, but eventually some decided that
theirs was
the only god. Then it became necessary to convince others of the
"truth" of
their god, at first by conquest and eventually by persuasion - and
this is
where we are today. And you think it just as necessary to convert
others to
your Atheist "truth" as any Christian or Muslim thinks it
necessary to convert people to their "truth."

Atheism serves the same function for you as Christianity does for a
fundamentalist Christian or Islam does for a fundamentalist Muslim,
it gives
you a sense of "I'm smarter (better, chosen, elected, etc.) than you
ignorant people who believe different than me."

Absolute tommy rot. how can that figure?

Atheists have no agenda, no priests no claims other than the
rejection of all religions as being primitive nonsense.


Perhaps there are some atheists without agenda, but you're not one of
them since you hang out in religious groups trying to convert the
nonsensical religious masses to atheism. You seem to see yourself as
a sort of "apostle Paul" of atheism.

(Had you been responding to a post originally posted to a.a, it would
have been a different matter, but you weren't, you are reading the
religious groups looking for something to use for proselytizing, just
as some of the idiots in the religious groups do - I do not condone
their behavior either, but I can at least understand that, in some
twisted way, they think they're doing their god a favor - what do you
hope to accomplish except to create more animosity and feed the
Fundamentalist martyr complex?)

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/

In news:rsGdncPVh-6eJC_VnZ2dnUVZ_jmdnZ2d at (no spam) comcast.com,
SongBookz <songbookz at (no spam) nospam.com> typed:
"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B230A0.575C94DA at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

"bob young" <alaspectrum at (no spam) netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:48B133D8.F9C93F7D at (no spam) netvigator.com...


SongBookz wrote:

Actually, no. once mankind acheived self awareness, religion
served an
important evolutionary purpose in enabling people to subborn self
and form
communities.

Groan, man from his very earliest days lived in groups; we
are/were like the wolves, pack animals.

Imaginary gods came millions of years later to enforce the
need for decent living, putting the fear of an imaginary got
into the minds of evil doers.


Speculative at best.

I prefer 'logical' top 'speculative'

All human societies have some sort of religious
beliefs.

In that case that should be enough for you to question the
sense in such an activities


The most primitive being the worship of the society's
primary food
source. Campbell suggested that people worshipped a representative
of their
primary food source as a means to appease their guilt over having
to kill to
eat.


Could be, or maybe they were worried there would not be
enough to eat later on

Thus, we have a bear god in Japan, the "Lamb of God" in the Middle
East, El the Bull in the same area, in my area, indigenous people
built mounds in the shape of turtles next to the river, and so
forth. Later the
gods became more sophisticated and mythologies grew, but it appears
that simple religious belief came with self-awareness, especially
awareness of death.

Eventually religions developed with moral codes that enabled people
to subborn self in support of the group. Thus the king of a city
state and later nations could use the gods as a means of inciting
people to common defense or offense, etc.

True

Even as late as the Middle Ages, kings ruled by
virtue of a "divine right." Religion pretty much served the
function now served by legal codes (which in itself is a religion
to some who serve the
Law over arriving at the truth).

At first, it was not so difficult for one city to have one set of
gods and
another to have different gods, but eventually some decided that
theirs was
the only god. Then it became necessary to convince others of the
"truth" of
their god, at first by conquest and eventually by persuasion - and
this is
where we are today. And you think it just as necessary to convert
others to
your Atheist "truth" as any Christian or Muslim thinks it
necessary to convert people to their "truth."

Atheism serves the same function for you as Christianity does for a
fundamentalist Christian or Islam does for a fundamentalist Muslim,
it gives
you a sense of "I'm smarter (better, chosen, elected, etc.) than you
ignorant people who believe different than me."

Absolute tommy rot. how can that figure?

Atheists have no agenda, no priests no claims other than the
rejection of all religions as being primitive nonsense.


Perhaps there are some atheists without agenda, but you're not one of
them since you hang out in religious groups trying to convert the
nonsensical religious masses to atheism. You seem to see yourself as
a sort of "apostle Paul" of atheism.

(Had you been responding to a post originally posted to a.a, it would
have been a different matter, but you weren't, you are reading the
religious groups looking for something to use for proselytizing, just
as some of the idiots in the religious groups do - I do not condone
their behavior either, but I can at least understand that, in some
twisted way, they think they're doing their god a favor - what do you
hope to accomplish except to create more animosity and feed the
Fundamentalist martyr complex?)

Pardon me for stumbling in... but was it not you who cross-posted this
thread to alt.atheist first?

Which group are you posting from, if I may ask? And what is your job
there?

--
Terrell D Lewis
http://thejokesonu.blogspot.com/




--
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