On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:33:38 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:02:11 -0300, Fred Williams <fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfc=
a
wrote:

Free Tibet wrote:

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=20
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:52 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
=20
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 04:55:05 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:02:01 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.c=3D om
wrote:

More Facts.

He is regarded as one of the most important figures in modern world
history.

He was named by Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential
people of the 20th century.

Along with Adolf Hitler, Ayatullah Khomeini, and Lenin.=3D20

Therefore..........?
=20
Um.. influentual and important don't mean Mao was 'good', sir?
=20

Good can be a relative term. =20

That's why I had 'good' in quotes, sir.=20

What's with all the numbers asnd codes? Is this Google posting?

It's not a matter of good versus bad. Was Hitler a bad man? Or was
he a man who did bad things? He was responsible for bringing
stability to Germany following WW1 and was instrumental in his support
of the People's car (Volkswagon). I think he developed Germany's
infrastructure, as well.

He let his ego get the better of him as many leaders do.

But it's not an important point. What is important is that he, along
with Mao and others, was one of the most influential people of the
20th Century whether you like it or not.

Mao effectively transformed China from an agrarian society to an
industrial giant - desite his brutal methods, which must be condemned.

It's important to look at the whole picture, not just parts and
corners.

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:55:51 -0300, Fred Williams
fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfca> wrote:

Mack A. Damia wrote:

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 09:24:13 -0700 (PDT), Anti-DabianchenVirus
wusong3 at (no spam) rocketmail.com> wrote:

The poster going with the IDs "abianchen" and "report2009" never went
to college.

Proof:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.china/msg/995a71070728ba0c?hl=en

There is nothing worse than abject ignorance, and in today's world,
there is no excuse for it. I get sick, tired and utterly fed up with
unenlightened opinions gleaned from others. So-called "experts" on
Usenet who know the "truth". I could vomit at times.

I'm a retired professor of political science, and I don't pretend to
know everything. My area of emphasis was political socialization, and
it appears that most folks get there political views from their
parents.

If parents are closed-minded rednecks, you can just about bet with
assurance that their children will turn out the same way.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Cheers!

That's true, but it is possible to change and education helps. It's
called "finding yourself" when you look to what your own value are and get
away
from those of your parents. It happened for me when I was 36 years old
and it changed my life.

Absolutely. I agree with you, but I think it's the exception and not
the rule (norm).

Mu = 100, and half the population have IQs less than 100.

Refer to the Bell Curve.

An IQ of less than 100 is pretty damn dull; every other person in the
Western World ( and probably the rest of the world, too) has very
limited critical thinking skills.

If you open your eyes and look around, this is fairly easy to
comprehend.

Waiting for the deluge, I remain..........

Mack A. Damia wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:55:51 -0300, Fred Williams
fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfca> wrote:

Mack A. Damia wrote:

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 09:24:13 -0700 (PDT), Anti-DabianchenVirus
wusong3 at (no spam) rocketmail.com> wrote:

The poster going with the IDs "abianchen" and "report2009" never went
to college.

Proof:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.china/msg/995a71070728ba0c?hl=en

There is nothing worse than abject ignorance, and in today's world,
there is no excuse for it. I get sick, tired and utterly fed up with
unenlightened opinions gleaned from others. So-called "experts" on
Usenet who know the "truth". I could vomit at times.

I'm a retired professor of political science, and I don't pretend to
know everything. My area of emphasis was political socialization, and
it appears that most folks get there political views from their
parents.

If parents are closed-minded rednecks, you can just about bet with
assurance that their children will turn out the same way.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Cheers!

That's true, but it is possible to change and education helps. It's
called "finding yourself" when you look to what your own value are and get
away
from those of your parents. It happened for me when I was 36 years old
and it changed my life.

Absolutely. I agree with you, but I think it's the exception and not
the rule (norm).

Mu = 100, and half the population have IQs less than 100.

Refer to the Bell Curve.

An IQ of less than 100 is pretty damn dull; every other person in the
Western World ( and probably the rest of the world, too) has very
limited critical thinking skills.

If you open your eyes and look around, this is fairly easy to
comprehend.

Waiting for the deluge, I remain..........

Well, there is a lot depending on the level of education. IQ is one thing,
but education also opens up the mind and a well educated person, even with a
"dull" IQ can still do great things, and understand life, politics, and
economics, and make a contribution.

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On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:56:54 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:33:38 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:02:11 -0300, Fred Williams <fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfc=
a
wrote:

Free Tibet wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
=20
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:52 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
=20
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 04:55:05 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:02:01 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.c=3D om
wrote:

More Facts.

He is regarded as one of the most important figures in modern world
history.

He was named by Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential
people of the 20th century.

Along with Adolf Hitler, Ayatullah Khomeini, and Lenin.=3D20

Therefore..........?
=20
Um.. influentual and important don't mean Mao was 'good', sir?
=20

Good can be a relative term. =20

That's why I had 'good' in quotes, sir.=20

What's with all the numbers asnd codes? Is this Google posting?

It's not a matter of good versus bad. Was Hitler a bad man? Or was
he a man who did bad things? He was responsible for bringing
stability to Germany following WW1 and was instrumental in his support
of the People's car (Volkswagon). I think he developed Germany's
infrastructure, as well.

He let his ego get the better of him as many leaders do.

But it's not an important point. What is important is that he, along
with Mao and others, was one of the most influential people of the
20th Century whether you like it or not.

Mao effectively transformed China from an agrarian society to an
industrial giant - desite his brutal methods, which must be condemned.

It's important to look at the whole picture, not just parts and
corners.

Well you can keep your wide-eyed view of Mao. I know what has happened to the
Tibetan people since 1950 and it's not pretty. No matter how much you laud your
CCP friends, genocide is the major result of their 'liberation'. And you can cut
the crap about eggs getting broken to make pavlova. Does the end justify the
means? Not unless you're Hannibal Lecter. Are you, sir?

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 17:18:31 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

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Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:56:54 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:33:38 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:02:11 -0300, Fred Williams <fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfc=
a
wrote:

Free Tibet wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
=20
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:52 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
=20
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 04:55:05 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:02:01 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.c=3D om
wrote:

More Facts.

He is regarded as one of the most important figures in modern world
history.

He was named by Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential
people of the 20th century.

Along with Adolf Hitler, Ayatullah Khomeini, and Lenin.=3D20

Therefore..........?
=20
Um.. influentual and important don't mean Mao was 'good', sir?
=20

Good can be a relative term. =20

That's why I had 'good' in quotes, sir.=20

What's with all the numbers asnd codes? Is this Google posting?

It's not a matter of good versus bad. Was Hitler a bad man? Or was
he a man who did bad things? He was responsible for bringing
stability to Germany following WW1 and was instrumental in his support
of the People's car (Volkswagon). I think he developed Germany's
infrastructure, as well.

He let his ego get the better of him as many leaders do.

But it's not an important point. What is important is that he, along
with Mao and others, was one of the most influential people of the
20th Century whether you like it or not.

Mao effectively transformed China from an agrarian society to an
industrial giant - desite his brutal methods, which must be condemned.

It's important to look at the whole picture, not just parts and
corners.

Well you can keep your wide-eyed view of Mao. I know what has happened to the
Tibetan people since 1950 and it's not pretty. No matter how much you laud your
CCP friends, genocide is the major result of their 'liberation'. And you can cut
the crap about eggs getting broken to make pavlova. Does the end justify the
means? Not unless you're Hannibal Lecter. Are you, sir?

Hang on while a stir the fava beans and chill the Chianti.

Nobody (at least not me) is lauding my "CCP friends". I don't have
any. Friends are *trouble* no matter where they live. Best to keep
them as "acquaintances" at arm's length.

China/Tibet/Taiwan are not the only countries and peoples in the world
to have gone through strife, mass murder, occupation and rotten eggs.

What about the Jews in Germany and Eastern Europe during WW2? Look at
all the suffering during WW2 of which China's role was marginal. I
don't hear voices from Eastern Europe crying, "nasty, bad Germans!"

That the ends don't justify the means is specious arguing. It
happened, Live with it. Despie all the brutality, Mao brought China
into the modern world - transformed it from an agrarian to an
industrial world power.

Get over your bitterness and move on. It will only destroy you. Work
to change the future, not the past.

On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 02:10:54 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

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On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:32:22 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 17:18:31 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:56:54 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:33:38 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:02:11 -0300, Fred Williams <fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfc=
a
wrote:

Free Tibet wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
=20
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:52 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
=20
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 04:55:05 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:02:01 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.c=3D om
wrote:

More Facts.

He is regarded as one of the most important figures in modern world
history.

He was named by Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential
people of the 20th century.

Along with Adolf Hitler, Ayatullah Khomeini, and Lenin.=3D20

Therefore..........?
=20
Um.. influentual and important don't mean Mao was 'good', sir?
=20

Good can be a relative term. =20

That's why I had 'good' in quotes, sir.=20

What's with all the numbers asnd codes? Is this Google posting?

It's not a matter of good versus bad. Was Hitler a bad man? Or was
he a man who did bad things? He was responsible for bringing
stability to Germany following WW1 and was instrumental in his support
of the People's car (Volkswagon). I think he developed Germany's
infrastructure, as well.

He let his ego get the better of him as many leaders do.

But it's not an important point. What is important is that he, along
with Mao and others, was one of the most influential people of the
20th Century whether you like it or not.

Mao effectively transformed China from an agrarian society to an
industrial giant - desite his brutal methods, which must be condemned.

It's important to look at the whole picture, not just parts and
corners.

Well you can keep your wide-eyed view of Mao. I know what has happened to the
Tibetan people since 1950 and it's not pretty. No matter how much you laud your
CCP friends, genocide is the major result of their 'liberation'. And you can cut
the crap about eggs getting broken to make pavlova. Does the end justify the
means? Not unless you're Hannibal Lecter. Are you, sir?

Hang on while a stir the fava beans and chill the Chianti.

Nobody (at least not me) is lauding my "CCP friends". I don't have
any. Friends are *trouble* no matter where they live. Best to keep
them as "acquaintances" at arm's length.

China/Tibet/Taiwan are not the only countries and peoples in the world
to have gone through strife, mass murder, occupation and rotten eggs.

What about the Jews in Germany and Eastern Europe during WW2? Look at
all the suffering during WW2 of which China's role was marginal. I
don't hear voices from Eastern Europe crying, "nasty, bad Germans!"

No, because those nasty Germans aren't still gassing Jews. Sheesh! Keep up, sir!
The CCP, on the other hand, continues to suppress, terrify, rape, sterilize,
imprison, torture, and murder ordinary Tibetans. China's suffering might be
marginal, but Tibet's isn't.

That the ends don't justify the means is specious arguing. It
happened, Live with it. Despie all the brutality, Mao brought China
into the modern world - transformed it from an agrarian to an
industrial world power.

So that makes everything done in his name ok? You keep avoiding the issue -
genocide is taking place in countries occupied by China. They learned how to do
it under Mao but this genocide is happening NOW, sir.

Get over your bitterness and move on. It will only destroy you. Work
to change the future, not the past.

Get over my bitterness?? Work to change the future, not the past??

Is your gout playing up, sir? Because your brain isn't functioning properly.
Perhaps it's the narrow, closed-minded, intellectual bubble you've been in for
all those years. Or is the red wine?

Not once have you admitted that China invaded Tibet and, under the name of
'liberation', perpetrated atrocities upon the Tibetan people, and continue to do
so to this day. These unspeakable things that the CCP is doing to the Tibetans
is defined as 'genocide'.

All you can see is some mythical Mao who might have done some naughty things
(like kill 70 odd million of his own people. Is that genocide?) but overall he
was ONE OF THE 100 MOST INFLUENTUAL PEOPLE OF THE 20TH CENTURY!! So he must
have been ok! Time Magazine said so! So Mao stands there along with Hitler and
Lenin! But Hitler made the VW so he's ok. hahaha And the Germans have stopped
killing Jews.. er..haven't they? hehehe Lenin took the US and UK bankers money,
the money withheld from the Czar, and formed a co-op. And again millions died.
But Lenin is ok because he's in there with Mao. Did he make the Skoda?? Can't
remember what car Mao built.

I wish you were joking, sir. But I can see you're not. One sick puppy.

I don't care.

By the way, I don't give a flying fuck, either.

Go pound Tibetan sand up your arse.

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On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:32:22 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 17:18:31 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:56:54 -0700, Mack A. Damia <mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:33:38 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:02:11 -0300, Fred Williams <fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfc=
a
wrote:

Free Tibet wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
=20
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:52 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote:
=20
On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 04:55:05 +0100 (BST), Free Tibet
freetibet at (no spam) nym.mixmin.net> wrote:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:02:01 -0700, Mack A. Damia
mybaconbutty at (no spam) hotmail.c=3D om
wrote:

More Facts.

He is regarded as one of the most important figures in modern world
history.

He was named by Time Magazine as one of the 100 most influential
people of the 20th century.

Along with Adolf Hitler, Ayatullah Khomeini, and Lenin.=3D20

Therefore..........?
=20
Um.. influentual and important don't mean Mao was 'good', sir?
=20

Good can be a relative term. =20

That's why I had 'good' in quotes, sir.=20

What's with all the numbers asnd codes? Is this Google posting?

It's not a matter of good versus bad. Was Hitler a bad man? Or was
he a man who did bad things? He was responsible for bringing
stability to Germany following WW1 and was instrumental in his support
of the People's car (Volkswagon). I think he developed Germany's
infrastructure, as well.

He let his ego get the better of him as many leaders do.

But it's not an important point. What is important is that he, along
with Mao and others, was one of the most influential people of the
20th Century whether you like it or not.

Mao effectively transformed China from an agrarian society to an
industrial giant - desite his brutal methods, which must be condemned.

It's important to look at the whole picture, not just parts and
corners.

Well you can keep your wide-eyed view of Mao. I know what has happened to the
Tibetan people since 1950 and it's not pretty. No matter how much you laud your
CCP friends, genocide is the major result of their 'liberation'. And you can cut
the crap about eggs getting broken to make pavlova. Does the end justify the
means? Not unless you're Hannibal Lecter. Are you, sir?

Hang on while a stir the fava beans and chill the Chianti.

Nobody (at least not me) is lauding my "CCP friends". I don't have
any. Friends are *trouble* no matter where they live. Best to keep
them as "acquaintances" at arm's length.

China/Tibet/Taiwan are not the only countries and peoples in the world
to have gone through strife, mass murder, occupation and rotten eggs.

What about the Jews in Germany and Eastern Europe during WW2? Look at
all the suffering during WW2 of which China's role was marginal. I
don't hear voices from Eastern Europe crying, "nasty, bad Germans!"

No, because those nasty Germans aren't still gassing Jews. Sheesh! Keep up, sir!
The CCP, on the other hand, continues to suppress, terrify, rape, sterilize,
imprison, torture, and murder ordinary Tibetans. China's suffering might be
marginal, but Tibet's isn't.

That the ends don't justify the means is specious arguing. It
happened, Live with it. Despie all the brutality, Mao brought China
into the modern world - transformed it from an agrarian to an
industrial world power.

So that makes everything done in his name ok? You keep avoiding the issue -
genocide is taking place in countries occupied by China. They learned how to do
it under Mao but this genocide is happening NOW, sir.

Get over your bitterness and move on. It will only destroy you. Work
to change the future, not the past.

Get over my bitterness?? Work to change the future, not the past??

Is your gout playing up, sir? Because your brain isn't functioning properly.
Perhaps it's the narrow, closed-minded, intellectual bubble you've been in for
all those years. Or is the red wine?

Not once have you admitted that China invaded Tibet and, under the name of
'liberation', perpetrated atrocities upon the Tibetan people, and continue to do
so to this day. These unspeakable things that the CCP is doing to the Tibetans
is defined as 'genocide'.

All you can see is some mythical Mao who might have done some naughty things
(like kill 70 odd million of his own people. Is that genocide?) but overall he
was ONE OF THE 100 MOST INFLUENTUAL PEOPLE OF THE 20TH CENTURY!! So he must
have been ok! Time Magazine said so! So Mao stands there along with Hitler and
Lenin! But Hitler made the VW so he's ok. hahaha And the Germans have stopped
killing Jews.. er..haven't they? hehehe Lenin took the US and UK bankers money,
the money withheld from the Czar, and formed a co-op. And again millions died.
But Lenin is ok because he's in there with Mao. Did he make the Skoda?? Can't
remember what car Mao built.

I wish you were joking, sir. But I can see you're not. One sick puppy.

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:11:04 -0300, Fred Williams
fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfca> wrote:

Mack A. Damia wrote:

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:55:51 -0300, Fred Williams
fred at (no spam) frewilliams.FFFfca> wrote:

Mack A. Damia wrote:

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 09:24:13 -0700 (PDT), Anti-DabianchenVirus
wusong3 at (no spam) rocketmail.com> wrote:

The poster going with the IDs "abianchen" and "report2009" never went
to college.

Proof:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.china/msg/995a71070728ba0c?hl=en

There is nothing worse than abject ignorance, and in today's world,
there is no excuse for it. I get sick, tired and utterly fed up with
unenlightened opinions gleaned from others. So-called "experts" on
Usenet who know the "truth". I could vomit at times.

I'm a retired professor of political science, and I don't pretend to
know everything. My area of emphasis was political socialization, and
it appears that most folks get there political views from their
parents.

If parents are closed-minded rednecks, you can just about bet with
assurance that their children will turn out the same way.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Cheers!

That's true, but it is possible to change and education helps. It's
called "finding yourself" when you look to what your own value are and
get away
from those of your parents. It happened for me when I was 36 years old
and it changed my life.

Absolutely. I agree with you, but I think it's the exception and not
the rule (norm).

Mu = 100, and half the population have IQs less than 100.

Refer to the Bell Curve.

An IQ of less than 100 is pretty damn dull; every other person in the
Western World ( and probably the rest of the world, too) has very
limited critical thinking skills.

If you open your eyes and look around, this is fairly easy to
comprehend.

Waiting for the deluge, I remain..........

Well, there is a lot depending on the level of education. IQ is one
thing, but education also opens up the mind and a well educated person,
even with a "dull" IQ can still do great things, and understand life,
politics, and economics, and make a contribution.

Not certain I agree with you on that. An IQ of less than 100 reveals
very poor critical thinking skills - generally speaking, although
there may may be areas of endeavor where that person can succeed.

Many people succeed in this world without a high IQ. Some of the richest

If you find these folks, say, posting to newsgroups, their mesages are
often rambling, don't make sense and are filled with personal
invectives.

I did work with retarded adults a long time ago and the one quality I

When you encounter them on the highways, they drive like bats out of
hell until they have to make a decision - such as "construction ahead
- merge now". That's where you get the mile backups! Notice how slow
and unreponsive they become in stop-and-go driving.

Do they also make unsubstantiated claims on newsgroups, lumping everything

I make constant observations where I live, and it never fails.