This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also drove
him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of Britain?

This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also drove
him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of Britain?

"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also drove
him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as weakness
and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the Guardian
article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was very different
from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that many people have
fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn Cameron and his party for
having Public School educations and a privelaged lifestyle and being a
"Toff"!!! Dear me! I surely cannot be the only person to realise that
Labour "also" have persons with privelaged lifestyles and a better
education than most, who also could easily be condemned as a Toff?
Hypocracy weyhey! I would say that the fears expressed, (unwisely, I have
to say, especially to the Guardian), by Cameron are pretty normal fears to
any decent minded person. Socialism is supposed to be bringing us all into
the realms of equality. So far dismally ineffective, with the disastrous
effect of destroying the country as we know it. Working Class, Middle
Class, Upper Class? So bloody what! We all have to work very hard indeed
to maintain our standards no matter what "Class" we might presume to come
from. To condemn a political party because it has a percentage of Toffs
within it's ranks is just plain balmy, bigoted and non-PC. No. Of all the
parties presented so far, the Conservatives are the obvious "right" party
to choose, warts and all! Any other party voted for will simply return
Labour, yet again!! Do you "really" want to do that? - In any case, plenty
of time before the election for Cameron to get his act together properly
and present a formidable alternative to Socialism. I am certain that he,
and his party, are listening to the opinions around them and will adjust
accordingly!

Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the
Guardian article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was very
different from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that many
people have fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn Cameron and
his party for having Public School educations and a privelaged lifestyle
and being a "Toff"!!!

Dear me! I surely cannot be the only person to
realise that Labour "also" have persons with privelaged lifestyles and a
better education than most, who also could easily be condemned as a
Toff? Hypocracy weyhey! I would say that the fears expressed,
(unwisely, I have to say, especially to the Guardian), by Cameron are
pretty normal fears to any decent minded person.

Socialism is supposed
to be bringing us all into the realms of equality. So far dismally
ineffective, with the disastrous effect of destroying the country as we
know it. Working Class, Middle Class, Upper Class? So bloody what! We
all have to work very hard indeed to maintain our standards no matter
what "Class" we might presume to come from.

To condemn a political party
because it has a percentage of Toffs within it's ranks is just plain
balmy, bigoted and non-PC.

No. Of all the parties presented so far, the
Conservatives are the obvious "right" party to choose, warts and all!

Any other party voted for will simply return Labour, yet again!!

Do you
"really" want to do that? -

In any case, plenty

of time before the
election for Cameron to get his act together properly and present a
formidable alternative to Socialism. I am certain that he, and his
party, are listening to the opinions around them and will adjust
accordingly!

Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the
Guardian article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was very
different from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that many
people have fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn Cameron and
his party for having Public School educations and a privelaged lifestyle
and being a "Toff"!!!

Dear me! I surely cannot be the only person to
realise that Labour "also" have persons with privelaged lifestyles and a
better education than most, who also could easily be condemned as a
Toff? Hypocracy weyhey! I would say that the fears expressed,
(unwisely, I have to say, especially to the Guardian), by Cameron are
pretty normal fears to any decent minded person.

Socialism is supposed
to be bringing us all into the realms of equality. So far dismally
ineffective, with the disastrous effect of destroying the country as we
know it. Working Class, Middle Class, Upper Class? So bloody what! We
all have to work very hard indeed to maintain our standards no matter
what "Class" we might presume to come from.

To condemn a political party
because it has a percentage of Toffs within it's ranks is just plain
balmy, bigoted and non-PC.

No. Of all the parties presented so far, the
Conservatives are the obvious "right" party to choose, warts and all!

Any other party voted for will simply return Labour, yet again!!

Do you
"really" want to do that? -

In any case, plenty

of time before the
election for Cameron to get his act together properly and present a
formidable alternative to Socialism. I am certain that he, and his
party, are listening to the opinions around them and will adjust
accordingly!

"Harry Merrick" <homestud at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7lj06oF3e0qjoU1 at (no spam) mid.individual.net...
Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?
Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/
Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the Guardian
article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was very different
from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that many people have
fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn Cameron and his party for
having Public School educations and a privelaged lifestyle and being a
"Toff"!!! Dear me! I surely cannot be the only person to realise that
Labour "also" have persons with privelaged lifestyles and a better
education than most, who also could easily be condemned as a Toff?
Hypocracy weyhey! I would say that the fears expressed, (unwisely, I have
to say, especially to the Guardian), by Cameron are pretty normal fears to
any decent minded person. Socialism is supposed to be bringing us all into
the realms of equality. So far dismally ineffective, with the disastrous
effect of destroying the country as we know it. Working Class, Middle
Class, Upper Class? So bloody what! We all have to work very hard indeed
to maintain our standards no matter what "Class" we might presume to come
from. To condemn a political party because it has a percentage of Toffs
within it's ranks is just plain balmy, bigoted and non-PC. No. Of all the
parties presented so far, the Conservatives are the obvious "right" party
to choose, warts and all! Any other party voted for will simply return
Labour, yet again!! Do you "really" want to do that? - In any case, plenty
of time before the election for Cameron to get his act together properly
and present a formidable alternative to Socialism. I am certain that he,
and his party, are listening to the opinions around them and will adjust
accordingly!

Sensible post.

I'm not even sure I recognise Cameron's vision anymore. Sorry.

"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:RcKdnd2dmLWiyWnXnZ2dnUVZ8hqdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...

I'm not even sure I recognise Cameron's vision anymore. Sorry.

This is a very revealing interview.

I'm surprised it hasn't been more widely shouted about.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/the_westminster_hour/8313536.stm


Thanks, I'll take a look if I can (wvm problems).

DVH wrote:
"Harry Merrick" <homestud at (no spam) hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:7lj06oF3e0qjoU1 at (no spam) mid.individual.net...
Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?
Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down
as weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/
Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the
Guardian article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was
very different from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that
many people have fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn
Cameron and his party for having Public School educations and a
privelaged lifestyle and being a "Toff"!!! Dear me! I surely cannot
be the only person to realise that Labour "also" have persons with
privelaged lifestyles and a better education than most, who also
could easily be condemned as a Toff? Hypocracy weyhey! I would say
that the fears expressed, (unwisely, I have to say, especially to
the Guardian), by Cameron are pretty normal fears to any decent
minded person. Socialism is supposed to be bringing us all into the
realms of equality. So far dismally ineffective, with the
disastrous effect of destroying the country as we know it. Working
Class, Middle Class, Upper Class? So bloody what! We all have to
work very hard indeed to maintain our standards no matter what
"Class" we might presume to come from. To condemn a political party
because it has a percentage of Toffs within it's ranks is just
plain balmy, bigoted and non-PC. No. Of all the parties presented
so far, the Conservatives are the obvious "right" party to choose,
warts and all! Any other party voted for will simply return Labour,
yet again!! Do you "really" want to do that? - In any case, plenty
of time before the election for Cameron to get his act together
properly and present a formidable alternative to Socialism. I am
certain that he, and his party, are listening to the opinions
around them and will adjust accordingly!

Sensible post.


Hmm. It says a lot of sensible things about Tory and Labour - but that
wasn't what I was discussing really.
It appears that what is needed is a leap of faith - something I'm not
very good at really.

Harry Merrick wrote:
Maria wrote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:AtidnQ2EZ_IquGnXnZ2dnUVZ8nGdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also
drove him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of
Britain?

Do you translate fear of failure and fear of letting others down as
weakness and inadequacy? If so, on what basis?


Have a guess. :-/

Well all I can say is that what "I" read and understood from the
Guardian article, (the Guardian? For Gods sake! SO Socialist!), was
very different from your implied opinion Maria. It seems to me that
many people have fallen badly into the "Class" trap and condemn
Cameron and his party for having Public School educations and a
privelaged lifestyle and being a "Toff"!!!

First, just to clarify, I am most definitely a conservative, not a
socialist!

Second, being rich and privileged does not preclude one from being
insecure - quite often it seems to exacerbate it. One is being judged
on privilege and possessions, not one's character, so that person in
many ways has more to prove to certain people.

Dear me! I surely cannot be the only person to
realise that Labour "also" have persons with privelaged lifestyles
and a better education than most, who also could easily be condemned
as a Toff? Hypocracy weyhey! I would say that the fears expressed,
(unwisely, I have to say, especially to the Guardian), by Cameron are
pretty normal fears to any decent minded person.

They may well be 'normal' fears, but is it appropriate for someone in
control of the political policy of an entire country?
I would prefer someone confident and mature, just as I would if I was
looking for a CEO for a business.

Socialism is supposed
to be bringing us all into the realms of equality. So far dismally
ineffective, with the disastrous effect of destroying the country as
we know it. Working Class, Middle Class, Upper Class? So bloody
what! We all have to work very hard indeed to maintain our standards
no matter what "Class" we might presume to come from.

I agree with all that.

To condemn a political party
because it has a percentage of Toffs within it's ranks is just plain
balmy, bigoted and non-PC.

I agree, but that's not my point. When Cameron was standing for
leadership, he voiced some pretty radical and sane opinions - on
legalisation of drugs for example, on Europe for another. The more he
has become embroiled in the leadership of the party, the more he has
shifted to the centre, perceived popular opinion, that which is still
influencing the Labour party today, even though those policies are now
highly unpopular.

No. Of all the parties presented so far, the Conservatives are the
obvious "right" party to choose, warts and all!

Depends on the warts - a benign one is harmless and will simply fall
off eventually - a malignant one takes over...

Any other party voted for will simply return Labour, yet again!!

I think that's probably true.

Do you
"really" want to do that? -

No - but should I keep my opinion of Cameron to myself for that
reason?

The only reason NuTory is getting my vote at all is because
my own MP is cheese-sparing on expenses and wants out of Europe.

In any case, plenty

Not really...he must realise that public opinion is slipping against
him right now - IMHO he needs to do a bit of Thatcherism and not
appear to be a ditherer like the idiot Brown.

of time before the
election for Cameron to get his act together properly and present a
formidable alternative to Socialism. I am certain that he, and his
party, are listening to the opinions around them and will adjust
accordingly!


Bliar is a typical example of someone who pretends to be certain
things in order to strike up an empathetical relationship with
certain people. Obarmy is another. Ingratiation is the name of the
game - appeal to everyone by making obscure 'promises' to gain
popularity. That's sort of reasonable (if underhand, but what else in
the world of politics?) if there is substance behind it and the
popularity gain is necessary to win power, but if what C says about
being terrified of failing is true, how will he ever be able to make
a sufficient commitment to anything? Defining 'failure' in politics
is difficult enough, because everyone wants something different. He
is always going to disappoint people, even some Tories - what he does
in response to that matters, a lot. You have to accept that you are
going to disappoint some people, a trick Thatcher managed quite
neatly, and still managed to be one of the most popular political
leaders. At the end of it all, people admire backbone - not to be
confused with stubbornness, something else Thatch could do at times,
but she had the commitment to see her vision through - I'm not even
sure I recognise Cameron's vision anymore. Sorry.

"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:RcKdnd2dmLWiyWnXnZ2dnUVZ8hqdnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...

I'm not even sure I recognise Cameron's vision anymore. Sorry.

This is a very revealing interview.

I'm surprised it hasn't been more widely shouted about.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/the_westminster_hour/8313536.stm

This is exactly what motivated Blair, IMHO.

"Mr Cameron said a terror of failure and letting others down also drove
him on. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6906219.ece

Do we really need another weak and inadequate man in control of Britain?