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Why Do We Need A Sovereignty Bill?...

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Maria...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:06 pm
Guest
This principle has been set for a long time.

'And, so far as withdrawal under I-59 is concerned, fortunately there is
a second, more powerful, string to the bow. In the Metric Martyrs' case,
Lord Justice Laws made an intriguing ruling: that Parliament does not
have the power to divest itself of its own sovereignty. In Britain,
sovereignty is derived from the people and, effectively, lent to Parliament.

"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against repeal,
wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act. Thus there is nothing in the 1972 Act
which allows the [European] Court of Justice, or any other institutions
of the EU, to touch or qualify the conditions of Parliament's
legislative supremacy in the United Kingdom. Not because the legislature
chose not to allow it; because by our law it could not allow it. That
being so, the legislative and judicial institutions of the EU cannot
intrude upon those conditions. The British Parliament has not the
authority to authorise any such thing. Being sovereign, it cannot
abandon its sovereignty."

This ruling echoes John Locke's argument that:

"The Legislative cannot transfer the power of making laws to any other
hands. For it being but a delegated power from the People, they who have
it cannot pass it to others."

http://www.brugesgroup.com/news.live?article=243&keyword=16#ratification
 
Special Care...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:06 pm
Guest
But what's the use of this?

The experience of "The Flying Vet" shows that the so-called "law" has
no meaning if elements of the ruing group decide to target a man like
Maurice Kirk because he has ruffled their feathers.
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.legal/browse_thread/thread/8e2786753c3e113b?hl=en#

The fate of Patrick Cullinane tells the same story.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian/2004/nov/06/features.jobsmoney15

The "law" has no meaning, if the ruling group say it has no
meaning........
....as in Humpty Dumpty..... Through the Looking Glass............

Why are you so anxious to show your prowess in intellectual wrangling,
Maria?

I reckon you need cunnilingus followed by a really hard fucking once
every day to calm you down, Maria.
Your husband is falling down on the job.
http://www.jamyewaxman.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/sex_cunnilingus.jpg
 
Special Care...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:06 pm
Guest
On Nov 4, 11:05 pm, Maria <oldwo... at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote:
Quote:

You need to stop seeing everything in the context of sex. I get more fun
from playing poker than that thanks.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I love playing poker.

But the mother-infant relationship is sex.

It's the universal imprint, which we are condemned to imitate and
repeat, Oxana Malaya style.

It's foolish to imagine any of us ever outlived that sexual
relationship with our mothers.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Oxana shows the power of "brain wiring"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMbf8R9BPyg

"Do You Want Your Oul' Lobby Washed Down, Con Shine?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y2uIhbzxO4
 
Mel Rowing...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:06 pm
Guest
On Nov 4, 11:00 pm, Maria <oldwo... at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote:

Quote:
"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against repeal,
wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act.

Lisbon amends the 1972 Act.

That's the bit I don't get - if I've got it right, the principle of
Parliamentary sovereignty means that no government can put into law
anything that would overturn Parliamentary sovereignty. It would simply
not be valid. Or have I got it wrong?

There's lots of scope for a constitutional crisis.

But surely only if the highest court struggles with this principle that
has stood for so long and effectively amends the law itself through
interpretation.

You are right!

Lisbon does not and cannot amend the 1972 Act which as an act of
parliament can only be amended or repealed by Parliament. Lisbon does
incorporate the Treaty of Rome which means that any withdrawal from
Lisbon would be a withdrawal from the EU altogether.

The only point I can see in a new Sovereignty Bill is that it could be
useful in preventing what Cameron calls "Legal creep" At the moment
judges in British Courts can apply rulings made in ECJ on the basis
that European Law supersedes British law (which will continue to be
the case) However, if there did exist UK law which prevented UK judges
applying EU law in areas where it has not yet penetrated, then the
situation whereby European Law could be applied more widely as time
passes could be avoided.

There was some suggestion tonight that this response by the Tories was
made on the hoof. I don't think so. They have known for a long time
that this situation was likely to come about. The response was
considered all right but more constrained than the rather bellicose, I
thought, presentation of Cameron delivered at his press conference
implied.

We shall have to see!
 
Special Care...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:06 pm
Guest
On Nov 4, 11:20 pm, Maria <oldwo... at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote:
Quote:
Special Care wrote:
On Nov 4, 11:05 pm, Maria <oldwo... at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote:
You need to stop seeing everything in the context of sex. I get more fun
from playing poker than that thanks.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I love playing poker.

But the mother-infant relationship is sex.

It's the universal imprint, which we are condemned to imitate and
repeat, Oxana Malaya style.

It's foolish to imagine any of us ever outlived that sexual
relationship with our mothers.

My mother dumped me. My father dumped me. I never had such a
relationship so I don't know anything about it, sorry. I have 6 lovely
children, who I would never dump, and that's been enough for me.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well my mother and father were emotional cripples, who were actually
the babies of the house, so it was *role reversal* .... the babies
taking care of the "parents" who were the real babies of the
house......

But my point was that the mother-infant relationship is a sexual
relationship whichever way it goes..... the intimate body contact is
unavoidable, so it's a sexual relationship even if rejecting and
dysfunctional........... and the way it "pans out" at the start of our
lives largely determines the course of our lives and the nature of our
civilsation.

Other factors come into play.
But the principle remains.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Careless Hands
http://docs.google.com/View?id=dddp6bt4_187gpmt3sjh
 
Special Care...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:26 pm
Guest
On Nov 5, 1:42 am, The gods have made us mad <star... at (no spam) destruction.com>
wrote:
Quote:
 It's a treat to see young
asylum seekers laughing and smoking on town centre benches, while
British lads of a similar age are dying in the third-world cess pit from
whence they came.

------------------------------------------------------------


I appreciate the things you say.

What do these young British soldiers think they are doing?
Getting their arms and legs blown off................ for WHAT?

Why would a soldier obey orders?

Why would anyone be a soldier in the first place?

----------------------------------------------------------------

Don't worry about conscription, you guys in the European Union.

It's coming real soon.
 
abelard...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:31 pm
Guest
it's just a gesture imv...

much depends on what people do....not what they say...

money has no value if people refuse to take in as
settlement/exchange...
law has no meaning if 'new' labour can *both* say
it is meaningless...and enforce that claim...

i read you comments and they seem to me to say
something similar...

if the courts won't play...
if the juries won't play...
if the people get out the pitchforks.....

regards

--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc over 1 million document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Special Care...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:42 pm
Guest
On Nov 5, 1:05 am, William Black <william.bl... at (no spam) hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
Quote:
The gods have made us mad wrote:

Not to mention the EU military conscription forms dropping through the
letterbox - how proud you'll feel when your own eligible relatives march
off to do their bit for the empire...

Do any EC countries still have conscription?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee

Just wait, laddie.

"Do any EC countries still have conscription?"

Hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee
Hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee

Conscription is an integral part of the EU project, you fool !
 
DVH...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:54 pm
Guest
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:puidnVCu1Ph0Z2zXnZ2dnUVZ8iudnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
Quote:

'And, so far as withdrawal under I-59 is concerned, fortunately there is a
second, more powerful, string to the bow. In the Metric Martyrs' case,
Lord Justice Laws made an intriguing ruling: that Parliament does not have
the power to divest itself of its own sovereignty. In Britain, sovereignty
is derived from the people and, effectively, lent to Parliament.

"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against repeal,
wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act.

Lisbon amends the 1972 Act.

There's lots of scope for a constitutional crisis.
 
Maria...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:00 pm
Guest
DVH wrote:
Quote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:puidnVCu1Ph0Z2zXnZ2dnUVZ8iudnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
'And, so far as withdrawal under I-59 is concerned, fortunately there is a
second, more powerful, string to the bow. In the Metric Martyrs' case,
Lord Justice Laws made an intriguing ruling: that Parliament does not have
the power to divest itself of its own sovereignty. In Britain, sovereignty
is derived from the people and, effectively, lent to Parliament.

"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against repeal,
wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act.

Lisbon amends the 1972 Act.

That's the bit I don't get - if I've got it right, the principle of
Parliamentary sovereignty means that no government can put into law
anything that would overturn Parliamentary sovereignty. It would simply
not be valid. Or have I got it wrong?

Quote:
There's lots of scope for a constitutional crisis.


But surely only if the highest court struggles with this principle that

has stood for so long and effectively amends the law itself through
interpretation.
 
Maria...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:05 pm
Guest
Special Care wrote:
Quote:
But what's the use of this?

The experience of "The Flying Vet" shows that the so-called "law" has
no meaning if elements of the ruing group decide to target a man like
Maurice Kirk because he has ruffled their feathers.
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.legal/browse_thread/thread/8e2786753c3e113b?hl=en#

The fate of Patrick Cullinane tells the same story.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian/2004/nov/06/features.jobsmoney15

The "law" has no meaning, if the ruling group say it has no
meaning........
...as in Humpty Dumpty..... Through the Looking Glass............

Has anyone said it has no meaning?

Quote:

Why are you so anxious to show your prowess in intellectual wrangling,
Maria?

You wouldn't say that if I was a bloke. My interest lies in that I
studied law at uni. Ok?

Quote:

I reckon you need cunnilingus followed by a really hard fucking once
every day to calm you down, Maria.
Your husband is falling down on the job.
http://www.jamyewaxman.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/sex_cunnilingus.jpg

You need to stop seeing everything in the context of sex. I get more fun
from playing poker than that thanks.
 
abelard...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:19 pm
Guest
On Wed, 04 Nov 2009 23:05:53 +0000, Maria <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk>
wrote:


Quote:
You need to stop seeing everything in the context of sex. I get more fun
from playing poker than that thanks.

a starving person only thinks of food...

regards

--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc over 1 million document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
James Hammerton...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:20 pm
Guest
DVH wrote:
Quote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:puidnVCu1Ph0Z2zXnZ2dnUVZ8iudnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
'And, so far as withdrawal under I-59 is concerned, fortunately there is a
second, more powerful, string to the bow. In the Metric Martyrs' case,
Lord Justice Laws made an intriguing ruling: that Parliament does not have
the power to divest itself of its own sovereignty. In Britain, sovereignty
is derived from the people and, effectively, lent to Parliament.

"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against repeal,
wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act.

Lisbon amends the 1972 Act.

The 1972 Act allowed EU laws to be incorporated into British law via
statutory instrument (a model now applied generally). Have the relevant
SIs been rubber stamped? Or is that still to come by the end of the year?

Quote:
There's lots of scope for a constitutional crisis.

True, and much of the scope comes from domestic legislation, let alone
"Lisbon"...

James

--
James Hammerton,
http://jameshammerton.blogspot.com/
http://www.magnacartaplus.org/news/
 
Maria...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:20 pm
Guest
Special Care wrote:
Quote:
On Nov 4, 11:05 pm, Maria <oldwo... at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote:
You need to stop seeing everything in the context of sex. I get more fun
from playing poker than that thanks.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I love playing poker.

But the mother-infant relationship is sex.

It's the universal imprint, which we are condemned to imitate and
repeat, Oxana Malaya style.

It's foolish to imagine any of us ever outlived that sexual
relationship with our mothers.

My mother dumped me. My father dumped me. I never had such a
relationship so I don't know anything about it, sorry. I have 6 lovely
children, who I would never dump, and that's been enough for me. Smile
 
James Hammerton...
Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:21 pm
Guest
Maria wrote:
Quote:
DVH wrote:
"Maria" <oldwoman at (no spam) theshoe.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:puidnVCu1Ph0Z2zXnZ2dnUVZ8iudnZ2d at (no spam) bt.com...
'And, so far as withdrawal under I-59 is concerned, fortunately there
is a second, more powerful, string to the bow. In the Metric Martyrs'
case, Lord Justice Laws made an intriguing ruling: that Parliament
does not have the power to divest itself of its own sovereignty. In
Britain, sovereignty is derived from the people and, effectively,
lent to Parliament.

"...Parliament cannot bind its successors by stipulating against
repeal, wholly or partly, of the 1972 Act.

Lisbon amends the 1972 Act.

That's the bit I don't get - if I've got it right, the principle of
Parliamentary sovereignty means that no government can put into law
anything that would overturn Parliamentary sovereignty. It would simply
not be valid. Or have I got it wrong?

Not sure, but Parliament had to ratify the treaty (not that it was any
trouble for the government to achieve this result)...

James

--
James Hammerton,
http://jameshammerton.blogspot.com/
http://www.magnacartaplus.org/news/
 
 
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