I have a number of 8mm films, many of which are over 40 years old. Some
are spliced together on 400ft reels and have been sitting in metal cans
for most of the time, a few are on 50ft reels and have been in the
original plastic cases, a few are just in paper boxes. Except for a
couple that got some crud dripped on them in the refrigerator (now kept
in a plastic box after cleaning with Film Renew), they all seem to be
in good condition, bright color etc. I believe all the film my Dad shot
was Kodachrome, don't know if this is significant.

A film supply company I've been buying items from tells me they
recommend vented plastic storage cans to avoid vinegarization of the
film. Hasn't been a problem so far but any opinions on this?

Thanks.

Most plastics contain compounds called plasticizers, which

brassplyer@yahoo.com wrote:
I have a number of 8mm films, many of which are over 40 years old. Some
are spliced together on 400ft reels and have been sitting in metal cans
for most of the time, a few are on 50ft reels and have been in the
original plastic cases, a few are just in paper boxes. Except for a
couple that got some crud dripped on them in the refrigerator (now kept
in a plastic box after cleaning with Film Renew), they all seem to be
in good condition, bright color etc. I believe all the film my Dad shot
was Kodachrome, don't know if this is significant.

A film supply company I've been buying items from tells me they
recommend vented plastic storage cans to avoid vinegarization of the
film. Hasn't been a problem so far but any opinions on this?

Thanks.

Most plastics contain compounds called plasticizers,

which can leak out as vapor and damage film.

Metal containers are safer for long-term storage.

I don't remember ever hearing or seeing the word "vinigarization", and
can't find it anywhere. I wonder what it means.

"Marvin" <physchem@cloud9.net> wrote in message
news:12hqf27jlajm9cb@corp.supernews.com...

brassplyer@yahoo.com wrote:

I have a number of 8mm films, many of which are over 40 years old. Some
are spliced together on 400ft reels and have been sitting in metal cans
for most of the time, a few are on 50ft reels and have been in the
original plastic cases, a few are just in paper boxes. Except for a
couple that got some crud dripped on them in the refrigerator (now kept
in a plastic box after cleaning with Film Renew), they all seem to be
in good condition, bright color etc. I believe all the film my Dad shot
was Kodachrome, don't know if this is significant.

A film supply company I've been buying items from tells me they
recommend vented plastic storage cans to avoid vinegarization of the
film. Hasn't been a problem so far but any opinions on this?

Thanks.

Most plastics contain compounds called plasticizers,


Not really. Some do, but by no means "most". Depends on the application.
Plasticizers are generally only used in things that are highly flexible
(think shower curtain, for example), and most often in PVC, since it's so
brittle without being plasticized. The film storage containers I've seen
are either HDPE or LDPE, which are almost never plasticized, particularly
when used in rigid applications like a storage case.



which can leak out as vapor and damage film.


Don't you think the film manufacturer would've taken that into account when
choosing a container?
Surely, but they aren't thinking about long-term storage.



Metal containers are safer for long-term storage.


Doesn't rust and other metal corrosion stain and chemically attack film?
For example, over time, metal oxides could catalyze depolymerization of the
celluloid film, or deacetylation. Seems to me that good pure plastic would
be a better answer.

I don't remember ever hearing or seeing the word "vinigarization", and
can't find it anywhere. I wonder what it means.


Umm...perhaps generation of a vinegary smell due to hyrolysis of acetic acid
from the cellulose acetate? You could find it if you spelled it right.
Most of the hits I get refer to the vinegarization of wine, and I hadn't
heard of it happening to old photographic film, but it seems plausible.
Presumably it's autocatalytic, since the acetic acid will both attract
moisture and catalyze the hydrolysis reaction. Venting of the vinegar would
slow down the autocatalysis.

Eric Lucas

lucasea@sbcglobal.net wrote:
"Marvin" <physchem@cloud9.net> wrote in message
news:12hqf27jlajm9cb@corp.supernews.com...

Most plastics contain compounds called plasticizers,

Not really. Some do, but by no means "most". Depends on the
application. Plasticizers are generally only used in things that are
highly flexible (think shower curtain, for example), and most often in
PVC, since it's so brittle without being plasticized. The film storage
containers I've seen are either HDPE or LDPE, which are almost never
plasticized, particularly when used in rigid applications like a storage
case.

which can leak out as vapor and damage film.

Don't you think the film manufacturer would've taken that into account
when choosing a container?

Surely, but they aren't thinking about long-term storage.

I don't remember ever hearing or seeing the word "vinigarization", and
can't find it anywhere. I wonder what it means.

Umm...perhaps generation of a vinegary smell due to hyrolysis of acetic
acid from the cellulose acetate? You could find it if you spelled it
right. Most of the hits I get refer to the vinegarization of wine, and I
hadn't heard of it happening to old photographic film, but it seems
plausible. Presumably it's autocatalytic, since the acetic acid will both
attract moisture and catalyze the hydrolysis reaction. Venting of the
vinegar would slow down the autocatalysis.

Search engines (e.g., Google) and an online dictionary I used suggest
alternate spellings.