Some OTHER detail about the "Ford at Fox" Collection

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Jim R.

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:42 am

Guest

This is pretty late, but I thought I'd pass on some information about
the Ford at Fox Collection that might be of use to some folks who
haven't decided whether to spring for the big boxed set.

Most folks probably know the 24 movies that are in it - 5 silents and
19 "talkies" - plus the documentary "Becoming John Ford."

There are 5 John Ford Fox and 20th Century Fox "talkies" that are not
in the set (not available anyplace else, either):

The Black Watch (1929)
Salute (1929)
Men Without Women (1930)
The Brat (1931)
Submarine Patrol (1938)

The surviving print of "Men Without Women" is kind of a mess anyway,
being a mostly silent work print for export, but what survives is
complete. I think.

Note that of the 5 missing Ford Fox "talkies," 4 are about the
military, 3 are about the Navy, and two are about the submarine
service. I'm not sure what to make of that.

The 10 surviving John Ford Fox silents not in the set are as follows:

The Village Blacksmith (1922-3)
Cameo Kirby (1923)
North of Hudson Bay (1923)
Lightnin' (1925)
Kentucky Pride (1925)
The Shamrock Handicap (1926)
The Blue Eagle (1926) (incomplete)
Mother Machree (1927- Cool

(incomplete)
Riley the Cop (1928)
Strong Boy (1929)

(A note about that last one. According to Fred Landesman's book "The
John Wayne Filmography" (McFarland, 2004), there is one known extant
print of "Strong Boy" - owned by a collector in Australia. That's
almost the same as lost, but as long as SOME print of a movie exists,
there's always hope...)

Of the 24 movies in the huge boxed set, four are not available
anyplace else - not in one of the three smaller "Ford at Fox
Collection" boxed sets, nor separately. So - if you want any of these
four movies, be prepared to pay the big bux:

Seas Beneath (1931)/Four Men and a Prayer (1938) (same disk)
The World Moves On (1934)
Tobacco Road (1941)

A couple of the silent movies are not available separately, but are in
the "John Ford's Silent Epics" multi-disc boxed set in the series from
Fox:

Just Pals (1920) (Just Pals an EPIC?! It's only 50 minutes long!)
Four Sons (1928)

All of the movies in "The Essential John Ford Collection" are
available separately, but note that the 1939 20th Cent. Fox movie
"Frontier Marshal," which Ford did not direct but was the inspiration
for "My Darling Clementine," is available only with "My Darling
Clementine." (It isn't even in the big 21-disc boxed set.)

Three movies in the "John Ford's American Comedies" set are not
available separately:

Dr. Bull (1933)/Judge Priest (1934) (same disk)
Steamboat 'round the Bend (1935)

That last one is also available in the "Will Rogers Collection" Vol. 1
set, but not available separately.

("Judge Priest" is not available separately from 20th C. F. H. E.,
anyway...)

"Wee Willie Winkie" was recently released separately and in the
"Shirley Temple Collection" Vol. 6.

I hope this information is helpful... - Jim Roebuck

Jason Liller

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:53 am

Guest

The big box also includes some print items that aren't available
elsewhere: a hardcover coffeetable book and reproductions of original
programs for two of the included silent films: FOUR SONS and THE IRON
HORSE. I doubt that these justify the price tag, but they may help
sway those who are on the fence.

I'd love to have those reproduction programs, but I opted for the
"Silent Epics" box and the separate BECOMING JOHN FORD documentary. I
already had THE GRAPES OF WRATH which was not improved in any way for
the "Ford at Fox" reissue.

--Jason Liller

Jim R.

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:11 pm

Guest

On Apr 30, 6:08 pm, Lloyd Fonvielle <navigareNOS...@cox.net> wrote:

Quote:

Jim Beaver wrote:
My brain may be in glitch mode. I've seen all the known extant Ford
films, silent and talkie, and THE BLACK WATCH a couple of times. It's
not silent? I'm really tired and may not be thinking straight, but I
remember that as a silent. Maybe I'm confusing it with HANGMAN'S HOUSE.

I believe it was made silent and reworked with talking bits. Not sure
what version survives.

Mar de Cortes Baja

www.mardecortesbaja.com<http://www.mardecortesbaja.com/blog

No, "Black Watch" isn't a silent film - not the one I saw, anyway. One
thing I distinctly remember about it is the corny way that Myrna Loy
"declaimed" in her "monologues" in the film. Hokey, hokey, hokey...

The one I saw was a "talkie" all the way through. But it may have
originally been silent and then "goat-glanded," as they useta say...
Matter of fact, I think it was.

Earlier comment: Yes, the coffee table book is outstanding. The
program books for "Iron Horse" and "Four Sons" are also beautiful. Oh,
also, the documentary is also available in the "Essential John Ford"
set too. It's an excellent documentary, in spite of what I consider a
stupid title, and is in black and white. Special features in the disk
- advertising galleries and still galleries, including some for movies
not in the sets and even lost films. The documentary is VERY good.
Peter Fonda is one of the people they talk to in it.

Also - I can't remember whether the earlier DVD version of "My Darling
Clementine" has the earlier 1 hour 43 minute pre-release version of
the movie, but the new DVD release does. Two versions, and "Frontier
Marshal" - lotsa stuff in that one.

Also also, "The Iron Horse" has the 2 hour 29 minute U. S. version and
the 2 hour 13 minute international version - on 2 disks. All DVD
releases of that movie have both of those versions. Well worth it.

Jim Beaver

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:47 pm

Guest

"Jim R." <mjroebuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cf5b6095-01d5-4813-a607-73f0f432cd73@b64g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...

Quote:

My brain may be in glitch mode. I've seen all the known extant Ford films,
silent and talkie, and THE BLACK WATCH a couple of times. It's not silent?
I'm really tired and may not be thinking straight, but I remember that as a
silent. Maybe I'm confusing it with HANGMAN'S HOUSE.

Jim Beaver

Lloyd Fonvielle

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:08 pm

Guest

Jim Beaver wrote:

Quote:

My brain may be in glitch mode. I've seen all the known extant Ford
films, silent and talkie, and THE BLACK WATCH a couple of times. It's
not silent? I'm really tired and may not be thinking straight, but I
remember that as a silent. Maybe I'm confusing it with HANGMAN'S HOUSE.

I believe it was made silent and reworked with talking bits. Not sure
what version survives.

Mar de Cortes Baja

www.mardecortesbaja.com <http://www.mardecortesbaja.com/blog>

dmkb

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:56 pm

Guest

Brownlow uses a clip from Black Watch in the Hollywood series expressly to
illustrate how bad early talking dialog was at the conversion to sound. This
clip never fails to get laughs in class.

Jim Beaver wrote:

Quote:

"Jim R." <mjroebuck@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cf5b6095-01d5-4813-a607-73f0f432cd73@b64g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
This is pretty late, but I thought I'd pass on some information about
the Ford at Fox Collection that might be of use to some folks who
haven't decided whether to spring for the big boxed set.

Most folks probably know the 24 movies that are in it - 5 silents and
19 "talkies" - plus the documentary "Becoming John Ford."

There are 5 John Ford Fox and 20th Century Fox "talkies" that are not
in the set (not available anyplace else, either):

The Black Watch (1929)

My brain may be in glitch mode. I've seen all the known extant Ford
films, silent and talkie, and THE BLACK WATCH a couple of times. It's
not silent? I'm really tired and may not be thinking straight, but I
remember that as a silent. Maybe I'm confusing it with HANGMAN'S HOUSE.

Jim Beaver

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