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Movies Forum Index » Movie Production (Sound) Forum » Multi-track with Panasonic AG-DVX-100
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| Brad Harper |
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 3:19 pm |
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I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7 DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way to do
buisness?
Brad Harper |
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| Philip Perkins |
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 9:37 pm |
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"Brad Harper" <bradharper@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<ZVQpc.60918$536.10294544@attbi_s03>...
Quote: I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7 DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way to do
buisness?
Brad Harper
If you can, have the cameras shoot TC slates at the every camera
start, the way we did concerts on film before Aaton code. Having a
visible TC reference makes it much easier to find things than your
audio LTC, which can only be read when the tape is moving.
Even if all the cameras can't do this having some of them do it will
make things easier in post.
Philip Perkins |
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| Philip Perkins |
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 9:39 pm |
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"Brad Harper" <bradharper@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<ZVQpc.60918$536.10294544@attbi_s03>...
Quote: I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7 DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way to do
buisness?
Brad Harper
If you can, have the cameras shoot TC slates at the every camera
start, the way we did concerts on film before Aaton code. Having a
visible TC reference makes it much easier to find things than your
audio LTC, which can only be read when the tape is moving.
Even if all the cameras can't do this having some of them do it will
make things easier in post.
Philip Perkins |
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| Back to top |
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| Charles Tomaras |
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 11:59 pm |
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"Brad Harper" <bradharper@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ZVQpc.60918$536.10294544@attbi_s03...
Quote: I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7 DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony
PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way to do
buisness?
Brad Harper
I did a six camera concert for DVD with the DVX-100's and 24 tracks of
DA-78HR. No timecode used whatsoever, most of the camera operators missed
the common mark at the head and they all had camera mics on. It was edited
in Sony Vegas 4 and once the editor got the video tracks lined up by
waveform and ear they held sync without much issue for the full project.
Cameras kept sync with each other near perfectly, and the audio was long by
about 5 or 6 frames by the end of the average tune length of maybe 7 or 8
minutes. He simply dragged the audio timeline at the end to match the video
and did not pitch correct. All in all, he says it was easier than dealing
with timecode and certainly made my life simple.
If you want to check out a sample...there are three tracks in WMV9 at:
http://www.timtyler.com/dvd/
Neumann KM-184's on toms, cymbals and hat. AKG 414 on snare, Shure Beta 52A
on Kick. Schoeps MK4's on percussion, most everything else was direct.
Charlie |
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| Philip Perkins |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 9:23 am |
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"Charles Tomaras" <tomaras@tomaras.com> wrote in message news:<IcCdndXm1ftXyTXdRVn-sw@comcast.com>...
Quote: "Brad Harper" <bradharper@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ZVQpc.60918$536.10294544@attbi_s03...
I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7 DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony
PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way to do
buisness?
Brad Harper
I did a six camera concert for DVD with the DVX-100's and 24 tracks of
DA-78HR. No timecode used whatsoever, most of the camera operators missed
the common mark at the head and they all had camera mics on. It was edited
in Sony Vegas 4 and once the editor got the video tracks lined up by
waveform and ear they held sync without much issue for the full project.
Cameras kept sync with each other near perfectly, and the audio was long by
about 5 or 6 frames by the end of the average tune length of maybe 7 or 8
minutes. He simply dragged the audio timeline at the end to match the video
and did not pitch correct. All in all, he says it was easier than dealing
with timecode and certainly made my life simple.
In reading Charles' post I think I would consider this approach in
lieu of the TC suggestions I made, if for no reason other than the
whole DV world is kind of timecode unfriendly, both FCP and the
cameras. Even when I've had full TC/genlock setups for multicam
shooting in concerts, I've had to mess with the sync in post to get it
to look right anyway, esp. on long lens shots. My only addition to
Charles' post would be to get the camera operators to stop tape as
seldom as possible--fewer resyncs. Oh, and have the editor get
Really Big drives!
Philip Perkins |
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| Oleg Kaizerman |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 9:34 am |
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just a question, if someone tried synchronize the cameras and da78 or pcm
800 with ext video reference during the recording for stopping the drift?
the dvx 100 doesn't have ext video ref but maybe it works threw the video
input like some recorders players (mostly old vhs) which was synchronized
for TV shooting ( video out from the camera to video in on the player
during pb)
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
"Philip Perkins" <spamiser@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3677d4b3.0405170723.2e2ff827@posting.google.com...
Quote: "Charles Tomaras" <tomaras@tomaras.com> wrote in message
news:<IcCdndXm1ftXyTXdRVn-sw@comcast.com>...
"Brad Harper" <bradharper@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ZVQpc.60918$536.10294544@attbi_s03...
I will recording an upcoming concert which is being shot with 5-7
DVX-100
cameras free roaming. I will be recording 32 tracks of audio on Sony
PCM-800
recorders and I am planning on sending 29.97nd timecode on
Lectrosonics
T1/R1 wireless to the all cameras to be recorded on audio track 2. I
will
leave the camera mics on channel 1 for a reference track for
editorial.
Does anyone have any additional ides or does this seem a logical way
to do
buisness?
Brad Harper
I did a six camera concert for DVD with the DVX-100's and 24 tracks of
DA-78HR. No timecode used whatsoever, most of the camera operators
missed
the common mark at the head and they all had camera mics on. It was
edited
in Sony Vegas 4 and once the editor got the video tracks lined up by
waveform and ear they held sync without much issue for the full project.
Cameras kept sync with each other near perfectly, and the audio was long
by
about 5 or 6 frames by the end of the average tune length of maybe 7 or
8
minutes. He simply dragged the audio timeline at the end to match the
video
and did not pitch correct. All in all, he says it was easier than
dealing
with timecode and certainly made my life simple.
In reading Charles' post I think I would consider this approach in
lieu of the TC suggestions I made, if for no reason other than the
whole DV world is kind of timecode unfriendly, both FCP and the
cameras. Even when I've had full TC/genlock setups for multicam
shooting in concerts, I've had to mess with the sync in post to get it
to look right anyway, esp. on long lens shots. My only addition to
Charles' post would be to get the camera operators to stop tape as
seldom as possible--fewer resyncs. Oh, and have the editor get
Really Big drives!
Philip Perkins |
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| Charles Tomaras |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 10:41 am |
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Guest
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"Oleg Kaizerman" <kaizero removeit@netvision.net.il> wrote in message
news:2gs4ciF63sc9U1@uni-berlin.de...
Quote:
just a question, if someone tried synchronize the cameras and da78 or pcm
800 with ext video reference during the recording for stopping the drift?
the dvx 100 doesn't have ext video ref but maybe it works threw the video
input like some recorders players (mostly old vhs) which was synchronized
for TV shooting ( video out from the camera to video in on the player
during pb)
In my situation the cameras were not monitored by anyone other than the
operator so there would have been no way to distribute the sync in the
first place as there weren't any wires being run. |
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| Oleg Kaizerman |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 11:08 am |
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Guest
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you say that the cameras stayed in perfect sync and only the da was swimming
few frames every few minutes , so if you supply camera video signal as (one
camera)
as reference signal to the da ,is it will lock it to the camera and it will
not drift ?
--
Oleg Kaizerman (gebe) Hollyland
"Charles Tomaras" <tomaras@tomaras.com> wrote in message
news:Tc6dneI5Be_fdjXdRVn-jA@comcast.com...
Quote:
"Oleg Kaizerman" <kaizero removeit@netvision.net.il> wrote in message
news:2gs4ciF63sc9U1@uni-berlin.de...
just a question, if someone tried synchronize the cameras and da78 or
pcm
800 with ext video reference during the recording for stopping the
drift?
the dvx 100 doesn't have ext video ref but maybe it works threw the
video
input like some recorders players (mostly old vhs) which was
synchronized
for TV shooting ( video out from the camera to video in on the player
during pb)
In my situation the cameras were not monitored by anyone other than the
operator so there would have been no way to distribute the sync in the
first place as there weren't any wires being run.
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| Ken |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 12:47 pm |
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Guest
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You can sync a whole flock of DVX100's by getting them in a huddle and
using a single remote control to set their clocks simultaneously. Then
you can set the camera's internal TC to free run (not the default). As
noted, they'll hold their sync quite well.
The remote comes free with every DVX100, but someone has to remember to
bring one along. To save some menu-hunting and cursing time: Clock
setting is in the camera's "Other Functions" menu; free run is in the
"Recording Setup" menu under "TCG".
This might not add much to Brad's approach except for backup, but it's a
handy tip when working with DVX100's.
KenK |
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| Charles Tomaras |
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 12:49 pm |
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"Oleg Kaizerman" <kaizero removeit@netvision.net.il> wrote in message
news:2gs9tbF6fe66U1@uni-berlin.de...
Quote: you say that the cameras stayed in perfect sync and only the da was
swimming
few frames every few minutes , so if you supply camera video signal as
(one
camera)
as reference signal to the da ,is it will lock it to the camera and it
will
not drift ?
Can't say for sure...the audio was recorded at 24/48 but the artist
converted it to 16/44.1 for his older mixing software, then it got
reconverted to 24/48 for the DVD. With all of that transfer and sample rate
mangling I can't say for sure what would have worked better. It's just so
simple to drag the end of the music and line it up with the end of the video
that any other solution would have been more work. I think for the most part
people overthink sync and make it into something more difficult than it
really is when dealing with long form projects like this. |
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