For those interested in the Remote Audio "Ground Adapter" (Boom Pole Stand),
it is available again, and has some improvements. For more info check out:
http://www.remoteaudio.com/ground_adapter.htm .

Glen Trew

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:49:42 -0600, "Glen Trew"
glen@nixthistrewaudio.com> wrote:

For those interested in the Remote Audio "Ground Adapter" (Boom Pole
Stand),
it is available again, and has some improvements. For more info check
out:
http://www.remoteaudio.com/ground_adapter.htm .

Glen Trew

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO

On 3/26/04 6:51 AM, in article qog8601vrdkqj60pkkhd81m439m2keh55d@4ax.com,
"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:



Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO



I have seen similar devices marketed for up to $800. and yes, some things
tend to cost a little more when they are specialized low volume selling
items built specifically for our use. Those who feel they can buy "under
$20.00" worth of parts and build one for themselves, certainly should do so.
Speaking for myself (and possibly others) I am quite pleased when someone
puts together something useful, well thought out, and spares me having to do
it all myself. What I do consider unreasonable, and this has happened many
times in the past, is when a company like Location Sound, Coffey Sound or
Trew Audio, finds a useful product from another consumer arena and puts it
up for sale in their store at greatly increased prices. This happened many
years ago when the various sound shops discovered C-clamps (notably Braun
and Rowi) in camera supply stores and then sold them as Microphone Clamps at
sometimes double the price they could be purchased as Camera Clamps. This is
not the case with the boom stand from Remote Audio.

Regards, Jeff Wexler

I have often asked people to buy me 5 yoke handles at $ 10 at Sammies (
30 min by car) and I would pay them the $ 5.00 gas add 30% to the item
and sell the damn handle for 13.50. BUT they have the NERVE to want to
get paid $ 20 for the hour and 36 cents a mile ( like government
workers) and all over sudden the $ 10 handle was $ 20 with a $ 4 profit
to meet company overhead per handle. Since noone works at $ 20 for just
1 hour I drive there and then get the stuff about doubling the price.
GET A LIFE.
selling to film folk is neither fun ( 3 followup phone calls on how to
use the stupid handle despite of the manual I wrote and did not factor
in the price - and I even answer the phone evenings) nor really
profitable. Trew and Cofee work on the set to make ends meet not
because they LIKE it. I wish I had more work but realize the lucky
situation I am in in only having to do commercials. LSC only makes it
becuse of a vast customer base and a few exclusive lines. Does Otto
really have a happy retired life in Hawaii? no --- he is in and out
and around his camera company. The largest of the camera rental houses
is in deep debt. Most Camera houses suffer and lay off staff when its
slow... Studios do nothing to support their suppliers, they demand deep
discounts pay late and dont sign contracts...
life is all roses though ask anybody.........
w

Jeff Wexler wrote:

On 3/26/04 6:51 AM, in article
qog8601vrdkqj60pkkhd81m439m2keh55d@4ax.com,
"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:



Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO



I have seen similar devices marketed for up to $800. and yes, some things
tend to cost a little more when they are specialized low volume selling
items built specifically for our use. Those who feel they can buy "under
$20.00" worth of parts and build one for themselves, certainly should do
so.
Speaking for myself (and possibly others) I am quite pleased when someone
puts together something useful, well thought out, and spares me having to
do
it all myself. What I do consider unreasonable, and this has happened
many
times in the past, is when a company like Location Sound, Coffey Sound or
Trew Audio, finds a useful product from another consumer arena and puts
it
up for sale in their store at greatly increased prices. This happened
many
years ago when the various sound shops discovered C-clamps (notably Braun
and Rowi) in camera supply stores and then sold them as Microphone Clamps
at
sometimes double the price they could be purchased as Camera Clamps. This
is
not the case with the boom stand from Remote Audio.

Regards, Jeff Wexler




--
NOTE I WAS ASSIGNED A NEW EMAIL ADDRESS:
wolfvid (replace this with the at sign) comcast.net

I have often asked people to buy me 5 yoke handles at $ 10 at Sammies (
30 min by car) and I would pay them the $ 5.00 gas add 30% to the item
and sell the damn handle for 13.50. BUT they have the NERVE to want to
get paid $ 20 for the hour and 36 cents a mile ( like government
workers) and all over sudden the $ 10 handle was $ 20 with a $ 4 profit
to meet company overhead per handle. Since noone works at $ 20 for just
1 hour I drive there and then get the stuff about doubling the price.
GET A LIFE.
selling to film folk is neither fun ( 3 followup phone calls on how to
use the stupid handle despite of the manual I wrote and did not factor
in the price - and I even answer the phone evenings) nor really
profitable. Trew and Cofee work on the set to make ends meet not
because they LIKE it. I wish I had more work but realize the lucky
situation I am in in only having to do commercials. LSC only makes it
becuse of a vast customer base and a few exclusive lines. Does Otto
really have a happy retired life in Hawaii? no --- he is in and out
and around his camera company. The largest of the camera rental houses
is in deep debt. Most Camera houses suffer and lay off staff when its
slow... Studios do nothing to support their suppliers, they demand deep
discounts pay late and dont sign contracts...
life is all roses though ask anybody.........
w

Jeff Wexler wrote:

On 3/26/04 6:51 AM, in article
qog8601vrdkqj60pkkhd81m439m2keh55d@4ax.com,
"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:



Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO



I have seen similar devices marketed for up to $800. and yes, some things
tend to cost a little more when they are specialized low volume selling
items built specifically for our use. Those who feel they can buy "under
$20.00" worth of parts and build one for themselves, certainly should
do so.
Speaking for myself (and possibly others) I am quite pleased when someone
puts together something useful, well thought out, and spares me having
to do
it all myself. What I do consider unreasonable, and this has happened
many
times in the past, is when a company like Location Sound, Coffey Sound or
Trew Audio, finds a useful product from another consumer arena and
puts it
up for sale in their store at greatly increased prices. This happened
many
years ago when the various sound shops discovered C-clamps (notably Braun
and Rowi) in camera supply stores and then sold them as Microphone
Clamps at
sometimes double the price they could be purchased as Camera Clamps.
This is
not the case with the boom stand from Remote Audio.

Regards, Jeff Wexler

When bringing any product to market, there is a definite law of economy
of scale. Whether buying from another manufacturer or building it
yourself, the smaller the volume, the higher the cost. Even nation wide,
the "Pro" film /video industry is considered a small market. How many
Ground Adapters do you think Trew will sell in a year? The development
and custom tooling cost have to be covered before any actual profit is made.


Wolf,
Even if the people you are asking agreed to do you the favor for $5.00,
you're still making less than 23% (not 30%) on your base costs. You
haven't considered overhead or other costs of sale like your time, phone
calls, any literature you develop and print, bookkeeping, etc.
Fortunately, you don't have commercial rent or utilities to pay for, or
advertising expenses, support staff, employee benefits and taxes, legal
fees, commercial insurance, or an investment in raw materials for
manufacturing, just to name a few of the expenses it takes to run a
business. Most people have no idea how much it costs to exhibit at a
trade show or place a single display ad in a magazine.

These are major expenses and have to be paid for from a portion of the
"profits" from every item sold.

Everybody wants everything cheap and is very demanding about customer
support, but how many are willing to support the dealers who support
them? It kills me when I hear a phrase like " B&H had this mic for
$10.00 less than Trew, Coffey, or ATS".

Marty Atias



Wolf wrote:
I have often asked people to buy me 5 yoke handles at $ 10 at Sammies (
30 min by car) and I would pay them the $ 5.00 gas add 30% to the item
and sell the damn handle for 13.50. BUT they have the NERVE to want to
get paid $ 20 for the hour and 36 cents a mile ( like government
workers) and all over sudden the $ 10 handle was $ 20 with a $ 4 profit
to meet company overhead per handle. Since noone works at $ 20 for just
1 hour I drive there and then get the stuff about doubling the price.
GET A LIFE.
selling to film folk is neither fun ( 3 followup phone calls on how to
use the stupid handle despite of the manual I wrote and did not factor
in the price - and I even answer the phone evenings) nor really
profitable. Trew and Cofee work on the set to make ends meet not
because they LIKE it. I wish I had more work but realize the lucky
situation I am in in only having to do commercials. LSC only makes it
becuse of a vast customer base and a few exclusive lines. Does Otto
really have a happy retired life in Hawaii? no --- he is in and out
and around his camera company. The largest of the camera rental houses
is in deep debt. Most Camera houses suffer and lay off staff when its
slow... Studios do nothing to support their suppliers, they demand deep
discounts pay late and dont sign contracts...
life is all roses though ask anybody.........
w

Jeff Wexler wrote:

On 3/26/04 6:51 AM, in article
qog8601vrdkqj60pkkhd81m439m2keh55d@4ax.com,
"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:



Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO



I have seen similar devices marketed for up to $800. and yes, some things
tend to cost a little more when they are specialized low volume selling
items built specifically for our use. Those who feel they can buy "under
$20.00" worth of parts and build one for themselves, certainly should
do so.
Speaking for myself (and possibly others) I am quite pleased when someone
puts together something useful, well thought out, and spares me having
to do
it all myself. What I do consider unreasonable, and this has happened
many
times in the past, is when a company like Location Sound, Coffey Sound or
Trew Audio, finds a useful product from another consumer arena and
puts it
up for sale in their store at greatly increased prices. This happened
many
years ago when the various sound shops discovered C-clamps (notably Braun
and Rowi) in camera supply stores and then sold them as Microphone
Clamps at
sometimes double the price they could be purchased as Camera Clamps.
This is
not the case with the boom stand from Remote Audio.

Regards, Jeff Wexler

It's still not worth $199.00.

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO

"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:qog8601vrdkqj60pkkhd81m439m2keh55d@4ax.com...

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO


And just "WHO" is the "my" in "IMO?" Come on Mack...if you are going to be a
rude price policeman and hammer Glenn Trew who is a regular "member" of this
newsgroup and makes some of the most useful products out there for
production sound, please let us know who you are with your real name and a
little background. That way all of the people who try to make a reasonable
living from production sound products can be sure to give you a "great" deal
when you come knocking on their doors. Have you posted here before?


Charles Tomaras
Seattle, WA

6 posts from Aug thru Dec 2003.

http://netscan.research.microsoft.com/Static/author/authorProfile.asp?searchfor=nfa917%40hotmail.com&searchdate=12%2F31%2F2003


big brother is watching....

For those interested in the Remote Audio "Ground Adapter" (Boom Pole Stand),
it is available again, and has some improvements. For more info check out:
http://www.remoteaudio.com/ground_adapter.htm .

Glen Trew

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO

"Mack" <nfa917nospam@hotmail.com> wrote:

Kind of expensive @ $199.00 don't ya think. I mean does everything
that has to do w/ this business, have to be outrageously overpriced?

the pieces of this ar probably under $20. Factoring in research and
development, marketing, etc. I can't see it being any more than $100,
and that's a stretch.

IMO

Then I guess Mack won't be getting the additional hooks?

Seriously, I'm sure that many people find the price high. But
interestingly,
just as many are surprised that it's as low as it is. As those who make
things for sale know, it's very tough to make a profit, no matter how you
price them.

But, just to shed some light on the Ground Adapter (boom stand), here are
some details of what's involved, starting with the hook assembly:

The hook assembly is not an off-the-shelf part from Home Depot. It had to
be
designed and built from the ground up specifically for mounting under this
stand. It, alone, costs about $30 if 50 are ordered. (The prototypes cost
even more, and have no resale value.) The hook is aluminum for light
weight,
and forged so that it doesn't bend under the weight of a 100' boom cable.
It's pivot point was designed so that it flips up to become a handle. The
hook's receptacle is custom punched out of stainless steel so that it will
not rust. There is a steel role pin pressed into the hook to lock it in
place, and the stainless steel receptacle has two notches to allow quick
removal. The back side of the hook is drilled and tapped for mounting the
rubber bumper to keep it from clanking against the support. A neoprene O
ring was sourced and added to the assembly to keep the hook from
accidentally working its way out. Tapping 4/40 threads into a bottomed
hole
in forged aluminum is tricky, and more than several bits have broken off
inide the hooks, trashing the bits and the hooks. Before quantity
production
runs were made, prototypes were ordered, tested, refined, and re-tested.

The nuts, bolts, washers and lock washers begin ordinary enough, bought in
bulk, but are then taken across town to a company that does a heat-n-dip
oxide treatment. This gives the hardware a black appearance and reduces
rusting.

I won't go into much detail on the material used for the seat and base
(it's
top secret), but it will probably never be found at Home Depot. It is
trucked in from several states away. The material is not cheap, and
neither
is the transport, but it is ideal for the stand.

Even the center post is not a common material (it's not PVC). It was
chosen
because it is black all the way through, stronger, and lighter than PVC.
It's also about 5 times the cost of PVC. Relatively large quantities have
to
be ordered, and then cut to length when it arrives, and stored until sold.

Several hundred T-nuts were ordered for mounting the hardware to the base,
then it was discovered that the T-nuts do not recess into the composite
material like they do in wood. So, several hundred threaded bushings were
ordered. This makes sure that no metal is exposed on the base to scratch
floors. Anyone need several hundred 3/8" T-nuts?

The truth is that an obsessive amount of thought, effort, and money goes
into a specialty product like this, and the hope is to make a profit (you
know, that paycheck we all work for). But the truth is, if it wasn't fun
to
do, $199 would not be worth the trouble, or the expense, which is why you
don't see them at Wal-Mart or Radio Shack.

But it is fun seeing that once a boom operator uses one, they usually
don't
want to be without it, so we'll keep making them. It is also encouraging
that we are sold out again, and have quite a few back orders to fill.

Thanks to all for the comments,

Glen Trew