Will this horribly broken anticompetitive software marketplace ever be
repaired?

Hi:

It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.

Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:

http://www.linear.com
http://www.liteon.com

Others that are unuseable or almost unuseable (they may seem fine on the
surface, but once you attempt to use more involved features, you get
stopped):

http://www.mellesgriot.com/
http://www.national.com/
http://www.panasonic.com/flash.html
http://www.diodes.com/products/catalog/search.php#
http://www.ramprg.com/en/index.aspx

I haven't tried Firefox yet, as I like the integration of Mozilla. I
wonder if Opera would work with these? I don't care about commercial
vs. free software, I just want to use Linux.

This just really sucks, folks. After nearing *10 years* of using Linux
as my primary desktop OS for 95%+ of my computing, the situation of
interoperability with the rest of the computing world is still hanging
precariously by a thread.

Chris Carlen <crobc@BOGUSFIELD.sbcglobal.net> writes:


Hi:


It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.


Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:


http://www.linear.com

http://www.liteon.com

And I put up sites for my students, and IE does not work worth a damn, and
I have no idea how to make it work-- and that is with simple pdf files.

Hi:

It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.
[snip}

Hi:

It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.

I maintain a VMware install of Win2k only to run a very small portfolio
of programs like Autocad, my Xilinx CPLD/FPGA tools, and some corporate
web apps at work. Internet activity I've done exclusively on Linux for
almost a decade.

Now I am collecting a growing list of web sites that just don't work
with Mozilla or Konqueror. They are sites I simply can't live without.
This is really depressing.

In the past I used to send polite emails to webmasters to consider
testing their sites to work better with Mozilla (Netscape). A few would
respond favorably, but most didn't care.

After a while you get to a point where you just simply can't boycott
participation in the mainstream, or spend hours out of your workday
testing sites with a long list of browsers and writing lengthy emails.
In other cases the priority of the site is simply greater than
philosophical concerns. Consider my stock brokerage, for instance,
which just doesn't work without IE. And consumer product oriented sites
are just increasingly hopeless without IE.

Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:

http://www.linear.com
http://www.liteon.com

http://www.liteon.com

LiteON is unuseable, and rather poorly rendered, at least on my
Mozilla 1.6.

Click "Products & Services" then run your mouse over the column of
categories on the left. I get hovering submenus that are dislocated
from the toplevel category, so that I can't possibly click on the subs.

Using Konqueror, I can't even get the submenus to appear.

Hi:

It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.

I maintain a VMware install of Win2k only to run a very small portfolio
of programs like Autocad, my Xilinx CPLD/FPGA tools, and some corporate
web apps at work. Internet activity I've done exclusively on Linux for
almost a decade.

Now I am collecting a growing list of web sites that just don't work
with Mozilla or Konqueror. They are sites I simply can't live without.
This is really depressing.

In the past I used to send polite emails to webmasters to consider
testing their sites to work better with Mozilla (Netscape). A few would
respond favorably, but most didn't care.

After a while you get to a point where you just simply can't boycott
participation in the mainstream, or spend hours out of your workday
testing sites with a long list of browsers and writing lengthy emails.
In other cases the priority of the site is simply greater than
philosophical concerns. Consider my stock brokerage, for instance,
which just doesn't work without IE. And consumer product oriented sites
are just increasingly hopeless without IE.

Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:

http://www.linear.com
http://www.liteon.com

Others that are unuseable or almost unuseable (they may seem fine on the
surface, but once you attempt to use more involved features, you get
stopped):

http://www.mellesgriot.com/
http://www.national.com/
http://www.panasonic.com/flash.html
http://www.diodes.com/products/catalog/search.php#
http://www.ramprg.com/en/index.aspx

I haven't tried Firefox yet, as I like the integration of Mozilla. I
wonder if Opera would work with these? I don't care about commercial
vs. free software, I just want to use Linux.

This just really sucks, folks. After nearing *10 years* of using Linux
as my primary desktop OS for 95%+ of my computing, the situation of
interoperability with the rest of the computing world is still hanging
precariously by a thread.


Will this horribly broken anticompetitive software marketplace ever be
repaired?


Good day!

Bill Unruh wrote:
Chris Carlen <crobc@BOGUSFIELD.sbcglobal.net> writes:


Hi:


It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.


Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:


http://www.linear.com

Some stuff that didn't work at LTC's site a few days ago, now works.
Perhaps they are getting some internal or external feedback guiding them
to straighten things out. When they first unveiled their site's
redesign a few months ago, it was a real mess for Windows and Linux
users alike.

http://www.liteon.com

LiteON is unuseable, and rather poorly rendered, at least on my Mozilla 1.6.

Click "Products & Services" then run your mouse over the column of
categories on the left. I get hovering submenus that are dislocated
from the toplevel category, so that I can't possibly click on the subs.
But since the only way to get to a product is by clicking a submenu, I
just can't proceed from this point.

You can also get to the categories by clicking on products in the dumb
little flash panel in the middle.

Anyway, the sub-menus seem to work fine in Firefox 1.0. Several of them
say "under construction" and nothing more. Perhaps they should have
done the pages instead of the flash thing.

Using Konqueror, I can't even get the submenus to appear.


Me neither, with Konq 3.3.2.

http://www.linear.com
http://www.liteon.com



I've just visited these two with mozilla running on my Gentoo mini-itx
system (with flash and pdf plugins enabled) - I wish you could tell me
what doesn't work - they looked fine to me.

Others that are unuseable or almost unuseable (they may seem fine on the
surface, but once you attempt to use more involved features, you get
stopped):

http://www.mellesgriot.com/
http://www.national.com/
http://www.panasonic.com/flash.html
http://www.diodes.com/products/catalog/search.php#
http://www.ramprg.com/en/index.aspx


Again, no apparent difficulties - I wish you would tell me what I'm
supposed to be having problems with.

Would you please elaborate a little: What does not work?

I visited the sites with the following set-up:

- Debian Woody
- kernel 2.4.27
- Mozilla 1.5 / 20031007
- libflashplayer.so 6.0r79
- Java Plugin 1.4.2_02-b03

and had no problems whatsoever.

Bob Hauck wrote:

Anyway, the sub-menus seem to work fine in Firefox 1.0.

Interesting. I wonder if the new codebase for Firefox is receiving the
testing, with Mozilla shriveling on the vine.

Hi:

It is getting to the point now where a large enough proportion of web
sites are simply unuseable with Linux browsers Mozilla and Konqueror,
that I have to face for the first time ever the horrid reality of
*needing* Windows to surf.

I maintain a VMware install of Win2k only to run a very small portfolio
of programs like Autocad, my Xilinx CPLD/FPGA tools, and some corporate
web apps at work. Internet activity I've done exclusively on Linux for
almost a decade.

Now I am collecting a growing list of web sites that just don't work
with Mozilla or Konqueror. They are sites I simply can't live without.
This is really depressing.

In the past I used to send polite emails to webmasters to consider
testing their sites to work better with Mozilla (Netscape). A few would
respond favorably, but most didn't care.

After a while you get to a point where you just simply can't boycott
participation in the mainstream, or spend hours out of your workday
testing sites with a long list of browsers and writing lengthy emails.
In other cases the priority of the site is simply greater than
philosophical concerns. Consider my stock brokerage, for instance,
which just doesn't work without IE. And consumer product oriented sites
are just increasingly hopeless without IE.

Then sadly, increasing numbers of technology oriented sites either are
unuseable or seriously compromized without IE, for instance:

http://www.linear.com
http://www.liteon.com

Others that are unuseable or almost unuseable (they may seem fine on the
surface, but once you attempt to use more involved features, you get
stopped):

http://www.mellesgriot.com/
http://www.national.com/
http://www.panasonic.com/flash.html
http://www.diodes.com/products/catalog/search.php#
http://www.ramprg.com/en/index.aspx


I haven't tried Firefox yet, as I like the integration of Mozilla. I
wonder if Opera would work with these? I don't care about commercial
vs. free software, I just want to use Linux.

This just really sucks, folks. After nearing *10 years* of using Linux
as my primary desktop OS for 95%+ of my computing, the situation of
interoperability with the rest of the computing world is still hanging
precariously by a thread.


Will this horribly broken anticompetitive software marketplace ever be
repaired?


Good day!