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Linux Forum Index » Linux - Suse Forum » Rsync dependencies...
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| Vahis... |
 Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 11:59 pm |
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I have been fiddling with the 11.0 KDE Live CD.
To fix stuff screwed by update from 10.3 to 11.0.
I needed rsync which it doesn't have.
Adding it drags about 75 megs of other stuff like OpenOffice Templates,
java, alsa etc.
If say memory is limited, installing these may be a bit problematic.
If a fast Internet connection is not available you
may not be able to do much with it.
Why is that?
Such things make it hard to change to openSUSE
Live CD as a tool kit for fixing things.
It's obviously not meant to be one.
But it would be nice to have a toolkit for your own distro, or at least
same type (openSUSE/rpm/Knoppix/others/deb)
I would drop stuff like games and office and add tools like mc, rsync
etc.
Has anybody tried to roll your own?
Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford |
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| houghi... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 1:57 am |
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Vahis wrote:
Quote: To fix stuff screwed by update from 10.3 to 11.0.
Seriously, why not just do a new install? You have read this group long
enough to have seen questions like 'I have version X of openSUSE. Can I
easily upgrade to X+1' and the answer that comes with it being 'Take a
backup, try it and if it doesn't work, do a new install'
Quote: Such things make it hard to change to openSUSE
Live CD as a tool kit for fixing things.
It's obviously not meant to be one.
Indeed it is not.
Quote: But it would be nice to have a toolkit for your own distro, or at least
same type (openSUSE/rpm/Knoppix/others/deb)
You can do a repair. However you are not talking about a repair of the
distro.
Quote: I would drop stuff like games and office and add tools like mc, rsync
etc.
I would drop KDE and the next would drop other things in addition of HIS
or HER choice.
Quote: Has anybody tried to roll your own?
Yes, I have made my own installation disk. No, I have not made my own
live CD. I just tried it and it gacve me the following error:
YaST got signal 11 at YCP file Kiwi.ycp:519
/sbin/yast2: line 421: 1031 Segmentation fault $ybindir/y2base
$module "$ at (no spam) " "$SELECTED_GUI" $Y2_GEOMETRY $Y2UI_ARGS
The last with the Product Creator.
So then I tried again with The Kiwi Imiga Creator and that is running
now. I will get back to how that went. rsync was something that was
selected. For fun I also selected KDE 3 to see if I am able to make my
own live CD (with MPLayer).
To do this YaST -> Miscellaneous and there you have both Image Creator
(with a Kiwi as logo) and Product Creator.
That is running now and I will see what happens.
houghi
--
Listen do you hear them drawing near in their search for the sinners?
Feeding on the power of our fear and the evil within us.
Incarnation of Satan's creation of all that we dread.
When the demons arrive those alive would be better off dead! |
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| Vahis... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 1:14 pm |
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On 2008-07-06, Nikos Chantziaras <realnc at (no spam) arcor.de> wrote:
Quote: Vahis wrote:
On 2008-07-06, houghi <houghi at (no spam) houghi.org.invalid> wrote:
Or you can add the DVD-iso you downloaded as a repo.
Sure I can. But that has nothing to do with this.
I was just wondering the amount of dependencies in this.
Everybody knows the word "dependency hell."
Maybe this kind of made up dependencies are a part of it.
Another reason why I finally gave up on this distro after so many years
working with it  Package management and dependencies really escalated
into some kind of monstrosity.
I must say I wonder why OpenOffice presentation templates need to be
installed with rsync.
Or alsa or java.
Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford |
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| houghi... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:33 pm |
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Vahis wrote:
Quote: Why would a running system want more software if the user does not want
it?
Because there was not enough space on the disc for everything they
wanted to put on there.
Quote: Maybe there's no other PCs around.
Then you are out of luck. Nop Network cvonnection is no rsync. Like I
said, there are things that I would like and don't get.
Quote: But sure I can carry stuff with me.
I just expect a live CD to be able to install one single piece of
software without made up dependencies.
Sorry, it can only install the things it has on its disc. As there is no
connection, nothing else can be installed.
Quote: Anyway, rsync is slower than cp.
Here also cp worked.
There is limited space and coming from a 6+ CD install back to 1 CD is
already amazing. There then need to be things that will not be included.
rsync is such a tool and I can understand why they have perhaps
understand why.
The times that rsync is often used is in a network enviroment. This
means that rsync is installable over the network, because you can
download it.
Quote: Or you can add the DVD-iso you downloaded as a repo.
Sure I can. But that has nothing to do with this.
Well. Partly yes. You want rsync without a network connection and I
offer a solution.
What you want is to have a rescue CD and that is not what the live CD
is, sorry.
Quote: I was just wondering the amount of dependencies in this.
Everybody knows the word "dependency hell."
Maybe this kind of made up dependencies are a part of it.
No, absolutely not. Dependency hell is when you have NO way of solving
things. This solves things the moment it can. It downloads things (78MB)
the moment it is able to do so. No worries. As there is no connection,
it won't download 78MB.
houghi
--
Listen do you hear them drawing near in their search for the sinners?
Feeding on the power of our fear and the evil within us.
Incarnation of Satan's creation of all that we dread.
When the demons arrive those alive would be better off dead! |
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| David Bolt... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:42 pm |
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On Sun, 6 Jul 2008, Vahis wrote:-
Quote: Just running Live CD without going to Software Management does not
launch it by itself. It wants nothing.
Which is to be expected. At that point you haven't asked the package
management system to satisfy all the dependencies.
Quote: Why would a running system want more software if the user does not want
it?
Several of the patterns used to create the Live CD have a large number
of packages that are "soft dependencies", or "recommended" packages.
This basically means they aren't required for a running system, but are
likely to be desirable.
However, once the various repos are added, the package management system
sees that these "soft dependencies" aren't installed, aren't marked as
"taboo", and so it marks them for installation. As they are just
suggestions, not actually required, you can de-select them and the
system will continue quite happily without them.
Quote: A slow connection is better than nothing though.
So if I'm behind a GPRS connection and I want to download a few
hundred k and the system wants 74 megs on top of that it makes helluva
difference.
Yes it does, which is one good reason why you should always check to see
what's actually being dragged in to satisfy dependencies. You can have a
look to see what's going to be installed by selecting the "Installation
Summary" filter.
Quote: I just expect a live CD to be able to install one single piece of
software without made up dependencies.
They aren't "made up" at all. they're just what is felt to be desirable
but not required for a working system. If they were, they'd have been
included on the Live CD.
Quote: Anyway, rsync is slower than cp.
Here also cp worked.
I also find cp to be faster, but I still prefer rsync as it's much more
capable of handling a restart if the copy process is broken for whatever
reason.
Quote: I was just wondering the amount of dependencies in this.
When you start the Software management with the main OSS repo enabled,
it loads the pattern DVD-11.0-110.3.${ARCH}.pat.gz. Then, as a part of
the dependency checks, it looks to see which patterns are installed,
whether all the required packages were installed, and also if there are
any "recommended" packages that haven't been installed, and are also not
marked as not to be installed. If there are some that aren't installed,
that haven't been unmarked by yourself, it automatically adds them.
If this had been 10.3, I'd have said look at the various pattern files
and see what's listed in the +Prc/-Prc section. These are packages that
are "recommended" but don't have to be installed[0]. However, this is
11.0 and all the various patterns are merged a single file, so you just
have to scroll up and down the file to find the relevant parts.
Also, you might want to check to see if there are any in the sections:
+Psp/-Psp supplemented packages
+Psg/-Psg suggested packages
+Pen/-Pen enhanced packages
Any in those four sections of a pattern aren't "needed" but may be
installed as "improvements" to the installed system.
Quote: Everybody knows the word "dependency hell."
Not quite. If they were hard dependencies, yes you could get into
dependency hell.
[0] one of the reasons that makeSUSEdvd adds any extra packages to the
+Prc/-Prc section is that they are desired, but not required, and also
means that you can install a pattern that "recommends" a package that
isn't actually on the installation media[1] without breaking.
[1] for instance, multimedia packages in the Packman repo that won't be
installed unless that repo is added as an additional installation
source.
Regards,
David Bolt
--
www.davjam.org/lifetype/ www.distributed.net: OGR at (no spam) 100Mnodes, RC5-72 at (no spam) 15Mkeys
SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit | openSUSE 10.3 32bit | openSUSE 11.0
SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit | openSUSE 10.3 64bit
RISC OS 3.6 | TOS 4.02 | openSUSE 10.3 PPC |RISC OS 3.11 |
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| houghi... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:16 pm |
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Guest
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Vahis wrote:
Quote: I must say I wonder why OpenOffice presentation templates need to be
installed with rsync.
Or alsa or java.
It will be installed with anything. It has absolutely no relation with
rsync. It has a relation with making a connection and it will download
stuff.
If you install with a connection it will download. The moment it can it
will download. It will download. Download it will. There will be
downloads done. The downloads will be done. Done will be the downloads.
houghi
--
Listen do you hear them drawing near in their search for the sinners?
Feeding on the power of our fear and the evil within us.
Incarnation of Satan's creation of all that we dread.
When the demons arrive those alive would be better off dead! |
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| Nikos Chantziaras... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:49 pm |
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Guest
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houghi wrote:
Quote: Vahis wrote:
I must say I wonder why OpenOffice presentation templates need to be
installed with rsync.
Or alsa or java.
It will be installed with anything. It has absolutely no relation with
rsync. It has a relation with making a connection and it will download
stuff.
But the OP said it's a dependency, not an update. YaST tells you if
it's a dependency or not. Updating is optional. The OP said there's no
way in hell he can install rsync without installing the other stuff too.
Or are you saying that openSUSE 11 will not let you install anything
unless you do an update? |
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| houghi... |
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:08 pm |
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Guest
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Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Quote: But the OP said it's a dependency, not an update. YaST tells you if
it's a dependency or not. Updating is optional. The OP said there's no
way in hell he can install rsync without installing the other stuff too.
Or are you saying that openSUSE 11 will not let you install anything
unless you do an update?
See the explanation from Dave.
houghi
--
Listen do you hear them drawing near in their search for the sinners?
Feeding on the power of our fear and the evil within us.
Incarnation of Satan's creation of all that we dread.
When the demons arrive those alive would be better off dead! |
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