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Please name a cross-platform FOSS app that is failing...

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Roy Schestowitz...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:40 am
Guest
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Quote:


Homer wrote:
Verily I say unto thee, that Matt spake thusly:
Roy Schestowitz wrote:

Does it matter if it's cross-platform though?
Does it matter in what sense?

Your responses remind me of Bill Gates' evasive depositions to the DOJ.


Depends by what you mean by the word "of".

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=eKcPx2jD5to "Gates Deposition Greatest Hits"

Watch the part about "dictionary".

- --
~~ Best of wishes

The folks on the Ubuntu CD cover need to apt-get shirt, not sudo fsck.
http://Schestowitz.com | GNU is Not UNIX | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
http://iuron.com - proposing a non-profit search engine
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Chris Ahlstrom...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 8:21 am
Guest
After takin' a swig o' grog, Matt belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Quote:
Homer wrote:
Verily I say unto thee, that Matt spake thusly:
Roy Schestowitz wrote:

Does it matter if it's cross-platform though?
Does it matter in what sense?

Your responses remind me of Bill Gates' evasive depositions to the DOJ.

Obviously I believe it matters whether it is cross-platform, and Roy has
to be aware of that in some sense, so it remains to ask in what sense he
intended his question. I don't know. Do you?

Ah, the scent of Tholen.

I'm through with this "topic".

--
667:
The neighbor of the beast.
 
chrisv...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:48 am
Guest
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

Quote:
It's getting pretty obvious that, if a project starts on Linux, it is often
cross-platform.

Why?

Because tools like GNU automake, perl, python, encourage it.

Cross-platform is the future, dude(s).

--
"Millions of people use XP Home daily with no issues." - "True Linux
advocate" Hadron Quark
 
Matt...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 7:55 pm
Guest
Homer wrote:
Quote:
Verily I say unto thee, that Matt spake thusly:
Please find for me a FOSS project that:

* does not have a Windows-only FOSS equivalent

Spot the oxymoron.

If you can, then you'll understand why this entire thread is redundant.


A Windows-only FOSS app can always be forked into a cross-platform app.
If it is forked, a lot of the bridge effect will be lost. But forking
may be the only way to make it cross-platform, as it will likely be hard
to get the current developers to switch from win32 to something like Qt
or GTK+.

I guess the forkers could produce a cross-platform version in parallel,
such version working like and using the same data formats as the
Windows-only version. The cost of producing such a version goes about
like the cost of reverse-engineering the GUI, since the forkers can
patch into the main body of code regularly. As Linux and Mac supplanted
Windows, the cross-platform version would supplant the Windows-only version.

On the other hand, while Linux usage is currently small, Linux+Mac usage
is a lot bigger, and that would make it easier to convince the current
Windows-only developers to take the project across platforms. By the
way, I don't expect huge increases in Linux usage until the
Windows/Office division of MS is a lot closer to broke due to
counter-Linux discounts.
 
Chris Ahlstrom...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 8:57 pm
Guest
After takin' a swig o' grog, Joerg Schilling belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Quote:
I don't know where you did get this wrong information from.

cdrecord (cdrtools) is the only cross platform FROSS CD/DVD/BD writing
software. Cdrtools currently has SCSI support for at least 22 different
operating system platforms (not counting variants that are caused by
different CPU types and counting all MS-WIN variants as only 1 platform).

cdrdao uses a very old SCSI transport lib from cdrtools and is not
written as portable as cdrtools is. It supports only CD media and a few
platforms.

growisofs only supports DVD media and even much less platforms than cdrdao.

If you take cdrtools from ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha/
the real problem is the limited portability of k3b.

K3b makes the mistake to try to send SCSI commands by itself instead of
calling cdrtools in order to get the needed information from drive and
medium in a really portable way.

Interesting.

ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha/win32/README.win32

cdrecord-1.8a22 or later can be compiled on Win9X/NT4 using Cygnus'
cygwin

The cygwin crutch. Have you verified your code on XP/Vista?

Quote:
counting all MS-WIN variants as only 1 platform).

Why is the Mac stuff so out-of-date?

Oh dear. Now Hadron's going to dun me for trolling poor old Jörg.

--
This fortune intentionally left blank.
 
Chris Ahlstrom...
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 8:59 pm
Guest
After takin' a swig o' grog, Matt belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Quote:
I guess the forkers...

Or the motherforkers <grin>.

Quote:
could produce a cross-platform version in parallel,
such version working like and using the same data formats as the
Windows-only version. The cost of producing such a version goes about
like the cost of reverse-engineering the GUI, since the forkers can
patch into the main body of code regularly. As Linux and Mac supplanted
Windows, the cross-platform version would supplant the Windows-only version.

On the other hand, while Linux usage is currently small, Linux+Mac usage
is a lot bigger, and that would make it easier to convince the current
Windows-only developers to take the project across platforms. By the
way, I don't expect huge increases in Linux usage until the
Windows/Office division of MS is a lot closer to broke due to
counter-Linux discounts.

.... So that they can't give back-handers to the OEMs.

--
I have no right, by anything I do or say, to demean a human being in his
own eyes. What matters is not what I think of him; it is what he thinks
of himself. To undermine a man's self-respect is a sin.
-- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
 
Homer...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 1:28 am
Guest
Verily I say unto thee, that Matt spake thusly:

Quote:
I suppose that the availability of any cheap or free Windows
equivalent would inhibit the development of any Windows-capable FOSS
equivalent, whether or not that Windows-capable FOSS equivalent were
also cross-platform. Maybe there are already ample cheap or free
disc-burning apps on Windows satisfying demand and acting as
placeholders, despite what you state above ...

My assertion was based on your original specification that these apps be
Free Software, but I see that once again you've decided to move the goal
posts when the answer doesn't suit your purposes.

If you want to talk about proprietary disc burning applications, then by
all means lets do so, but bear in mind that few (actually, only two) are
cross-platform, and neither one of them are by any means "popular" under
Linux, so that argument won't suit your purposes either.

Perhaps it's time to consider the possibility that you're just wrong.

--
K.
http://slated.org

..----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
05:28:30 up 86 days, 13:11, 4 users, load average: 0.00, 0.04, 0.14
 
Homer...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 1:35 am
Guest
Verily I say unto thee, that Chris Ahlstrom spake thusly:
Quote:
After takin' a swig o' grog, Matt belched out this bit o' wisdom:

I guess the forkers...

Or the motherforkers <grin>.

Isn't that what Jörg Schilling calls Debian package maintainers?

[smirk]

--
K.
http://slated.org

..----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
05:35:02 up 86 days, 13:17, 4 users, load average: 0.08, 0.06, 0.11
 
Matt...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:49 am
Guest
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Quote:
After takin' a swig o' grog, Matt belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

I guess the forkers...

Or the motherforkers <grin>.

could produce a cross-platform version in parallel,


If the corksoakers would make the thing cross-platform in the first
place, the forkers wouldn't have to do a forking thing.
 
Chris Ahlstrom...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:19 am
Guest
After takin' a swig o' grog, Joerg Schilling belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Quote:
Thank you for cdrecord. I used to use cdrecord and mkisofs from the
command line. Now I guess I still use them through Nautilus, which pops
up when I insert a blank disc on Ubuntu.

On Ubuntu there unfortunately is currently neither cdrecord nor mkisofs.
The software they distribute instead is from a broken illegal fork.
===================


Why don't you sue someone, then?

--
QOTD:
"I sprinkled some baking powder over a couple of potatoes, but it
didn't work."
 
Matt...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:31 am
Guest
Joerg Schilling wrote:

Quote:
I wonder whether you can say anything about the prospects for bringing
XP/Vista/7 support to cdrecord. Especially I wonder why you aren't
calling for volunteers to implement that support.

"Vista" is NT-6.0, "Win-7" is NT-6.1. Do you believe that Microsoft
will break interfaces in a minor release upgrade?


Ha ha, well I don't know. I thought that one of the complaints about
Vista was that it broke a lot of software that worked earlier on XP.
Certainly a lot of XP and Vista users wouldn't know. Maybe it's better
that way, so you don't get a lot of emails from XP users asking for
help. :-)

By what you have said, cdrtools/cdrecord is cross-platform by anybody's
definition.

It has been more than 14 years since the release of NT 3.5, which is the
most recent ancestor of XP and Vista mentioned on your site.

I suppose the important people already know it, but if you were to
mention XP and Vista at the cdrtools site, it might prevent some mistakes.

Maybe it could prevent the wrong information being put on Wikipedia by
making the wrong information less viable.

Thanks again for cdrtools.
 
Chris Ahlstrom...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:35 am
Guest
I made light of the out-of-date nature of some of Jörg's cdrecord
architectures. Very naughty.

Anyway, I download one of his latest cdrecord tarballs

ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha/cdrtools-2.01.01a57.tar.bz2

and skimmed the project, and am impressed with the style and plat-form
support in it. The code is very neatly done and looks easy to read.

The only "bad" things are the Kernighan-and-Ritchie function prototypes and
the relative lack of comments.

It is obvious that there is a huge amount of attention to detail in the
code.

Anyway, I like to jibe Jörg for his defensiveness, but just wanted to let
him know that I'm glad he initiated CD-recording software for UNIX/Linux and
that his code looks better on the face of it than a lot of code I've seen.

And apologize for trolling him in COLA [removed that crosspost].

Chris
 
Joerg Schilling...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:13 am
Guest
In article <N_Ygl.308$z9.118 at (no spam) bignews1.bellsouth.net>,
Chris Ahlstrom <linonut at (no spam) be11south-sucks.net> wrote:
Quote:
After takin' a swig o' grog, Joerg Schilling belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Thank you for cdrecord. I used to use cdrecord and mkisofs from the
command line. Now I guess I still use them through Nautilus, which pops
up when I insert a blank disc on Ubuntu.

On Ubuntu there unfortunately is currently neither cdrecord nor mkisofs.
The software they distribute instead is from a broken illegal fork.
===================

Why don't you sue someone, then?

Sueing people is the last resort......

Not doing it today does not mean it will not happen in the future.

--
EMail:joerg at (no spam) schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin
js at (no spam) cs.tu-berlin.de (uni)
schilling at (no spam) fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/
URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily
 
Doug Mentohl...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:23 am
Guest
Joerg Schilling wrote:

Quote:
Rule of thumb: don't believe Wikipedia as long as it's Administrators actively suppress correct information and replace it by FUD.

This may be part of a FUD campaign at Wikpedia as WP at the same time lists other CD writing software as "platorm independent" that has been ported to less than 4 platforms.

You are totally correct, I have noticed a relentless campaign to keep
self-serving retrospective corporate propaganda up on Wikipedia. It
appears to have been totally hijacked by certain vested interests.

Don't post to COLA, it's occupied by a number of very nasty individuals,
who will not hesitate to trash your reputation if you contradict them ..
 
Måns Rullgård...
Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:31 am
Guest
Chris Ahlstrom <ahlstromc at (no spam) launchmodem.com> writes:

Quote:
After takin' a swig o' grog, Joerg Schilling belched out
this bit o' wisdom:

Thank you for cdrecord. I used to use cdrecord and mkisofs from the
command line. Now I guess I still use them through Nautilus, which pops
up when I insert a blank disc on Ubuntu.

On Ubuntu there unfortunately is currently neither cdrecord nor mkisofs.
The software they distribute instead is from a broken illegal fork.
===================

Why don't you sue someone, then?

Probably because he knows he's wrong. It's not only Ubuntu either.
Most distributions ship the sanitised fork nowadays.

Jörg certainly know a great deal about CD recording, but it's really
hard to take him seriously with all the arrogance, lies, and
chest-thumping.

--
Måns Rullgård
mans at (no spam) mansr.com
 
 
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