wunnuy <wunnuy@netzero.net> wrote:
: After seeing the great Goose named as futures manager, I went back and
: looked at his stats again and again, wonder why in the wide world of
: sports is he not in the Hall? Especially during that ten year period
: (excepting the one year he started) he was one of the all time
: greatest stoppers and that was when relievers would rack up the
: innings. Is he going to get in?

He should, IMO; he's pretty clearly the 2nd best relief pitcher ever.

He should, IMO; he's pretty clearly the 2nd best relief pitcher ever.

Dvd Avins <dvdNOavinsSPAM@pobox.com> wrote:
: <jhb@socrates.Berkeley.EDU> wrote in message

:> He should, IMO; he's pretty clearly the 2nd best relief pitcher ever.

: The second best *retired* relief pitcher, anyway. And still 2nd best in
: career value. But Rivera's sustained peak is enough, IMO, to move him
into
: the same range as Goose overall.

I don't agree. Gossage still has almost three times Rivera's IP.
Gossage's peak was roughly nine seasons (leaving out his SP season, and
also his first year with the Pads, so it's 9 out of 11 years). Rivera
will get to nine this year. Rivera will have a better quality, fewer IP
peak -- eyeballing it, I think it'll be around 300 fewer IP, and it's
probably not a huge quality edge.

I think Rivera has probably moved to the front of the peak-only guys
(leaving Quiz and Sutter behind). But Gossage's peak is similar to
those peaks, and then Gossage piled on years of useful work -- less
valuable than Eckersley's, but still valuable.

BTW, I still have never seen a good explanation for Sutter's popularity
vs. Gossage in the voting. Totally bizarre to me.

jhb@socrates.Berkeley.EDU> wrote in message

He should, IMO; he's pretty clearly the 2nd best relief pitcher ever.

The second best *retired* relief pitcher, anyway. And still 2nd best in
career value. But Rivera's sustained peak is enough, IMO, to move him into
the same range as Goose overall.

In article <8isAc.45348$Xw3.27638@nwrdny03.gnilink.net>,
"Dvd Avins" <dvdNOavinsSPAM@pobox.com> wrote:
jhb@socrates.Berkeley.EDU> wrote in message

He should, IMO; he's pretty clearly the 2nd best relief pitcher ever.

The second best *retired* relief pitcher, anyway. And still 2nd best in
career value. But Rivera's sustained peak is enough, IMO, to move him into
the same range as Goose overall.

The problem is that Rivera's peak is long in years, but very short in
innings.

---------------------------------------------
David M. Nieporent nieporen@alumni.princeton.edu

After seeing the great Goose named as futures manager, I went back and
looked at his stats again and again, wonder why in the wide world of
sports is he not in the Hall?

In article <5c3cdaf6.0406171526.4035857c@posting.google.com>,
wunnuy@netzero.net (wunnuy) writes:
After seeing the great Goose named as futures manager, I went back and
looked at his stats again and again, wonder why in the wide world of
sports is he not in the Hall?

Don't know! He's getting my top vote for the Virtual Hall of Fame
( http://doug.obscurestuff.com/vhof.html ), even though he's not in
the Cooperstown HoF. He finished fourth in the most recent election,
just a single third-place vote away from election.

It wouldn't be the first time someone is elected to the VHOF before
the HOF -- Ron Santo got in and if I recall properly, Smokey Joe
Williams and George Davis got into both at about the same time.

Doug

masseyd@valhalla.no.spam.com (Douglas T. (Doug) Massey ) wrote in message news:<cav9gt$dka$2@news.btv.ibm.com>...
In article <5c3cdaf6.0406171526.4035857c@posting.google.com>,
wunnuy@netzero.net (wunnuy) writes:
After seeing the great Goose named as futures manager, I went back and
looked at his stats again and again, wonder why in the wide world of
sports is he not in the Hall?

Don't know! He's getting my top vote for the Virtual Hall of Fame
( http://doug.obscurestuff.com/vhof.html ), even though he's not in
the Cooperstown HoF. He finished fourth in the most recent election,
just a single third-place vote away from election.

It wouldn't be the first time someone is elected to the VHOF before
the HOF -- Ron Santo got in and if I recall properly, Smokey Joe
Williams and George Davis got into both at about the same time.

Where's Brooks Robinson? And what about Ted Simmons?